Airdasher player looking to get in on that 3D hype.

Hey guys, I'm an Blazblue/Guilty Gear player with about 3 years of experience who is looking to at least try to casually get into VF. So before I get started I had a few questions.

1. How daunting would the learning curve for this game be on pad? I typically play high execution characters in other games, so that isn't really an issue. My main concern is that I play on analog stick, and the one thing that has made me shy away from 3D is the thought of learning to move around with it. Is this viable?

2. In every other game I play, I favor the relentless rushdown characters with great flexible movement and a really strong mixup and Okizeme game (Valkenhayn in BB and Millia in GG). When I get in, I like to stay in. So within VF, who would fit this arcehtype? I know that the archetypal gameplay styles vary between 2D and 3D, but I don't have much else to go on. So far from what I've seen Brad looked like he might fit the bill. Any input would be great. I have dabbled in 3D as well from time to time, so in Soul Calibur I played Taki/Yoshimitsu, I played Helena in DOA5U, and in Tekken I liked Steve and Lee if that helps at all.

3. Is this a game you can play casually and still be somewhat competent? Being a college student, voice actor, and anime player leads to me not having much time for more games, so I'd love to know how much time I'd have to sink into this game before I could be considered even remotely decent. Remember I'm not looking to become godlike, I just want to be able to understand the game, know some confirms, and have fun with it.

4. Would 2D fundamentals help in any way with the transition to 3D? A goofy question I know, but I figured I would ask anyway.

Thanks in advance guys!

 

Lol I dunno about the analog stick working, I think it'll be too hard to input accurate directions. But hay if you play anime with it you might be able to make it work.. but I still recommend d-pad if you don't want to get a stick or hitbox. In regards to execution this game has a 10f buffer window to input your stuff, no 1f links and what not here! Though there are just frame moves several characters have, and some tricky inputs for certain defensive techniques.

A good rushdown character is Sarah. @BLACKSTAR can tell you all about her. Though brad is also a good choice, he is a more rounded and easier character. If I was going to recommend a character it'll be Sarah as she has to rely a lot on core VF fundamentals more so than brad does and that will teach you more about virtua fighter as a game. She may be easy to bust scrubs but shes a technical and hard to use character at higher levels.

VF ain't no casual game son. You wont stand a chance vs anyone whos half good at the game. Though nobody is stopping you from being a causal.

In regards to 2d mechanics, you'll find 3d to be pretty different: No overheads to beat crouching opponents (mids are for that), attacks will ALWAYS beat throws, there is a guard button in this game, jumps aren't as useful (though still have their uses) and a plethora other things. The best skills a 2d fighter can teach you to carry over to 3d is mix ups and yomi, imo.

Hope this helps!

 

Thanks, I'll still give it a try regardless. And when I said "casual play" I meant I was still willing to put in some time to learn, but I was just wondering if it would be one of those "If this isn't your main game, you're gonna be trash forever" situations. I'll be fine with placing last at every tournament and just treat it as a learning experience.

Thanks for the character recommendations as well. I'll try out Sarah and Brad once I pick up the game.

 

^^This is what I meant.

You can put in work for a few months to get good then leave and go play anime and what not, then you comeback to play more, ofc your skill has deteriorated but also keep in mind that coming back to VF after a break then going again over and over will severely limit the speed of how good you get at this game, not to mention each time you come back your skill has lessened. it'll feel like you will be "trash forever" unless you invest a significant (we're talking months, years if you want to be competitive at high levels) amount of time to get good. But like you said, you have lots of stuff going on and play other fighting games..

Don't get me wrong, I am NOT saying "Go back to playing anime, filthy scrub casual. VF is too hard 4 u". Just keep in mind this isn't a sort of pocket game you can play and expect to win against good competition with a month or so of practice. But like I said, nobody is stopping you from having fun, play it however and whenever you like.

EDIT:

If thats how it is you'll have no problems pal.

 

It definitelly is. As an example kingo (top EU plaer) and denkai (top US player) are both playing on gamepads.

1st thing you need to understand about VF that while it definitelly follow the archetype style of FGs, you can play every character in many different ways. That sayed, I will say that for strong to-your-face characters you should go for Brad, Jacky, Pai and Sarah, or even Lau. On more mixup side, you can have Lei Fei, Eileen or Lion; also Shun as strong mixup-char may work for you.
It all depends on what specifically suits you. The more information you provide to us, the better we can help you Also try to watch somne high-level videos to see what rings the bell for you

Well this depends. Vf5FS have very simple basics yet stil is very deep. You can spend 1 month with the game and if you are skilled, smart and someone will help you, you will be competitive. Not on top level, but enough to enjoy the game for sure.

Yes they will definitelly. You should be used to spacing, which is important in 3D - only think about evade as about a jump in a way Or about Focus Attack from SF
I have dfew 2D friends and they all where able to get graps about VF basics pretty fast.

 

This is the first mark of any decent player. Sadly, it's a mentality that most players don't have these days. Stick to it while forgetting that "get the W" crap and you'll continue to make the game a better experience for everyone else.

 

1. Use the d-pad and you won't have any problems, unless you're some kind of analog stick wizard, VF has pretty simple directional input requirements for moves overall.

2. VF doesn't really have the infinite blockstun and frame advantage coupled with 50/50 guessing games every second type characters like Eddie or Millia in GG, very few characters have moves that have some meaningful + frames on guard moves in this game so instead rushdown is confied to the more simpler means like using pokes, pressing the advantage at a nitaku situation (two way guessing game) and sometimes just plain boldness and mashing.

3. It's no different from any other game depending on who you play with, if you play with other beginners offline, or online with pretty much anybody left over at ranked who isn't from this site (they're all shit even though they have like 5000 games played), you don't have to invest that much time in this game, the basics are pretty easy to learn. Of course you can't expect to get good without sinking time into the game, just like with all things.

4. Spacing exists and is as important as almost any fighting game, however you may feel the movement in this game quite gimped compared to anime games as the characters' evade and backdash go a predetermined distance every time unless you cancel it (not into moves though) and there is no invulnerability frames or such, other than that basic execution skills help I guess?

 

TBH I always felt VF to be very forgiving in terms of how much your handle on the game deteriorates. Sure, you'll be rusty, but most of the rust will be gone really fast, especially when you're a beginner (you will forget stance/character specific combos and stuff).

I think because of how structured and consistent the game works, it's kind of like riding a bike: once you get the handle of it, you'll be able to come back to it at any time and pick up where you left off

The game is fun, good that you're giving it a go.

 

Pad is OK, Analog stick can be tougher to "tap" than the pad... Arcade stick is the ultimate of course , but using a pad will be fine to learn the game , the Evading Crouch Dash (ECD) is the one thing that can be a pain on a pad (but pads differ) Thats the 233~g movement (down,downforward,downforward) also One direction of crouch dash can be more sensitive than another (stupid pads) but this is all nitpicking...youll be fine and eventually if you grow to love the game youll prob upgrade to a stick eventually.

Also, try to not get used to button mapping (my opinion) I am a purist who only uses the three buttons this game was meant to have- Guard Punch Kick. But on a pad , this can be a problem with the default setup so I use...

Xbox

Y=Kick
B=Kick
A+Punch
X=Guard

This allows you to only use the face buttons and no button map shortcuts. ( I didnt want to walk up to a VF machine and not be able to play, )

 

That button mapping argument is so bullshit and done to death that I'm surprised people still have issues with it let alone talk about it.

 

FYI, This was just my thoughts, I have NEVER talked about it before, nor did I know it was an issue. Back when VF came to home gaming systems (yay saturn), I thought to myself, how will I ever play this game on a controller, I eventually did of course, but always wanted to keep it as "real" as I could... thats all.

But now that its controversy...Ill add that I have known a few players that literally can not play the game on a VF machine, or even a standard arcade stick because what they got used to was so different...

I thought that would be a no brainer...

I wonder which you use Yomi

 

The bottom line about it is that it is a totally pointless handicap aking to some sort of newbie/scrub "honor" system where "spamming" and "cheap moves" is frowned upon for no reason other than just because. I use button mappings on my pad, P+K and K+G specifically, because I cannot reliably press those inputs with the face buttons while holding the controller normally, I find the claw-style grip awkward and I am not going to learn it just to please some people griping about non-issues, and especially because I can just map shortcuts to shoulder buttons. I also do not play stick and doubt I ever will in addition to never going to play FS in an arcade, just like 96% of western VF players, so I don't have to worry about such things, it's pure practicality for me plus totally legal in tournaments because shortcuts are not macroes, even though some people would have (and had) it banned.

 

lol I must agree with Yomi
There is nothing wrong with button bindings. Gamepad is NOT ment to be used in the same way as stick and as long as binding are allowed even on tourneys like Evo and whatever else, there is no point in frowning upon them except to make youreslf feel good that you where able to put someone down...

 

I simply (and Naively) gave my personal preference and my reasoning for it. There was no intent on "judgment" or "putting people down" and this simple preference seemed to ruffle feathers , and then all of a sudden you are putting me down for stating what I use...

I can understand if you never intend on using a VF machine, and that the gamepad is not designed well, it is a pain in the ass, I still dont use mapping because of my previous reasons...that is all... and I will continue to give my opinion when asked.

 

I've fallen heavy into air-dashers for the past few years, but have been itching to get back into VF too.

Regarding the question fundamentals carrying over to VF from air-dashers, I'd say it really depends on what kind of characters you've been playing. So many character in BB and GG let you get by while only focusing on a particular aspect of the game that they specialize in. There aren't too many that require you really play a balanced frame-trap/high/low/throw/bait game all at once. Even fewer require you to cycle back-and-forth from offense to defense as rapidly as you'll have to in VF. (I want to say Millia's challenging neutral game is pretty stop-and-go in that respect though, so you might have a brain for it.)

Still, if one dabbles in enough different characters, I can't see any element of VF being that foreign to an anime player. Overall, it's just a more at the pace of air-dasher neutral all the time, without the shift in tension that comes in anime games when someone starts implementing their pressure or oki mindgames. Or, at least, that's what I notice.

 

It is no more daunting than with any other type of controller. Playing on a pad is definitely not an issue. You may hear opinions this way and that because most of the really oldtimer Vf-players (like me) originally started playing the game in arcades and as such are used to using a joystick. It has been proven time and time again that playing on a joystick is not a requirement to being a great Vf player.

It is basically possible to play any character as rushdown, depending on how good you are at reading your opponent. Since rushdown in VF is pretty much about mixing it up and making your opponent guess wrong each time, while remaining frame-tight. Of course this would require you to memorize most advantage/disadvantage situations.

There are really no characters in VF that would allow you a "freeroll" rushdown. There is a defense for everything and a good player will read you and defend correctly.

Out of the character roster, which characters shine in offense more than others, I would say Sarah, Eileen and maybe Jacky. Sarah has a lot of advantage on block moves and good mixups, and not much in the way of defensive moves. Eileen has large variety in attack strings due to her special cancels (although she is considered low tier). I mention Sarah and Eileen mainly because it makes little sense playing them in defensive fashion.

Jacky is just an all-around great character whose moves tend to be safe on block with massive combodamage potential on counterhits so he can rush you down easily.

Aoi could be played rushdown easy (despite low combopotential) because of her guard-cancels.
Lion could be played aggressively because he is one of the few characters with truly good lows and as such strong mixups. Etc.

I dont think you can get good in this game without investing time in it. But if you really get into it, I would say Vf is very rewarding.

I dont really know what 2D fundamentals mean, but VF rewards good movement sideways with a unique sidestep system.