Books on Fighting Styles

I prefer the art form of kitchen. I train 12 hours a day watching the tea pot shoot steam from it's spout when boiling. This loosely translates into one of my trademark moves, the ventor. After that I get out the mop and pour mr. clean in only to watch the reaction of the concentrated soap form bubbles in the water from chemicals reacting to a water base. This I call convertor. Finally, I get out a bag of tator tots and place them in the oven to cook to a golden brown. I call this finishing blow, tator.
Ventor, Convertor, and Tator all form bullshitatron. With this power my art from is uncomparable to all. Walk with tiny steps not to wake the slumbering bullshitatron, because it could be your last.

Your art form my art form, who cares? It seems you guys are battling a war that has no end and started way before any of you could walk. I have a opinion and you do too, so that's it.

peace^_^

 

I see athletic individuals with rippling muscles and KO power in the UFC. I have never seen such in the chinese TMA

What can i say other than your an idiot.

I see some of the poorest fighters to enter boxing in the heavy weight devision these days they have NO fighting abilty they are only big.

I would like to see someone like tsu fight them in an open weight division. It might wake you people up.

Now go run to your steroides and your arnie movies and enjoiy the big strong men ok /versus/images/graemlins/smile.gif

I'll stiick to actual techniuqes.

(Those people need to get in the ring and understand that when you take a shot to the jaw your world changes.)
Your such an expert please do tell me whats your experience on the street again?


Have you been concused with server guys beating the shit out of you in a fetal position no? well i have been hit in the head with an aluminium bat ? no well i have.

You talk alot of shit you tough guys who do sport but the fact you talk tough proves you havent been in a real fight.

The ring isnt real it dosent even try to simulate reality as the fight is broken into rounds and you have your trainer by your side to hold your hand.

(TMA nuthuggers will watch a fight with a TMA practitioner, and then when the guy loses will say, "well he should have done this".)

Your just trying to undermine me and the style with typical slander pity you guys can never be anything other than hotstile.

Must such being such a loser.

 

Okay I'm going to ask the pressing question everyone here has been wondering...




Is English your first language?

 

Realy mate go out with your jiujitsu onto the street and roll around on the cenment with someone mabey you;ll be lucky and only get cut with broken glass and not get puntured with a syringe,

Reality ISNT wide open space its NOT a nice comfy matt.

Athleats are big in MMA because they NEED to be.
Its broken into serveral rounds and a fight could last hours.

How many fights in reality have you seen that lasted hours? Being that big dosent just make you a target as looking threatening but it also makes you slow and easy to cut and easy to unbalance.

In real life fights last at most a few minutes its all about who gets hurt first being big wont help you there. Only in the ring dose being large help protect you.

Being large dose make you hit harder it also makes you extreamly unco.

Tysion wasnt the bigest guy in boxing. It wasnt his muscle that made his punching powerful its the way he fights its his structure. He's an infighter.

 

is English your first language?


Do you see more condesending tactics. Thats all you guys can ever and will ever do.

You dont contribute actual science to fighting you just say hey crocop big man me think crocop strong fighter.
Little man weak big man strong.

You make idiotic comments to an entertainment fighting circut that is NOT reality and you contribute nothing to what you slander as "theory".

So i supose everything we learn just gos out the window huh?

 

People learn to defend themself because THEY ARENT BIG.

Otherwise they wouldent need to. So you got huge guys in mma what the hell has that got to do with a styles effectivness?

 

I'm asking because if it is i feel bad for you.

And tyson didn't succeed because he was an infighter -- there's hundreds of other infighters that didn't have his success -- it's because of his explosive power and his literally wanting to kill his opponents. I don't think he believed he possessed some esoteric boxing knowledge that you seem to claim exists.

I feel like richard dawkins arguing with a creationist right now. The creationist (you) has read in the bible (some bullshit martial arts book), that things exist in a certain way, despite all the evidence to the contrary.

Honestly man, you think that video posted shows guys with any actual skill whatsoever? Are you kidding me?

And you're correct, fighting based around theory is bullshit.

And yes, there is no asian person in the world/has ever existed in the world that can beat crocop in a fight (ok, i guess it depends on whether you believe in the legend of kimura or maybe choi controlling him in a weird way which would actually be cool to see). lol man i almost do sound closed minded -- but it's really just common sense.

 

[ QUOTE ]
Evil_Pai said:

People learn to defend themself because THEY ARENT BIG.

Otherwise they wouldent need to. So you got huge guys in mma what the hell has that got to do with a styles effectivness?

[/ QUOTE ]

I agree with your point about being smaller and jigoro kano is proof that little people rock!

 

(I'm asking because if it is i feel bad for you.)- More slander love it /versus/images/graemlins/wink.gif

(And tyson didn't succeed because he was an infighter -- there's hundreds of other infighters that didn't have his success -- it's because of his explosive power and his literally wanting to kill his opponents.)- Here i actualy agree with you but its the way tysion fought note because of his bodytype.

(I don't think he believed he possessed some esoteric boxing knowledge that you seem to claim exists.)- Well im not sure if its esoteric or not but i certainly havent seen many people use mike tysions peekaboo method of geting in close,

The fact is it was Cus D'Amato's teaching that made tysion the force he was and when he died tysion's abilty went downhill.

While we are on the subject i would recomend reading jack dempseys book Championship Fighting: Explosive Punching and Aggressive Defence.

And if you read it notice how demseys punches THAT HE LEARNED TO USE ON THE STREET are a VERTICAL fist and very much similar to that on ving tsun. His stance is also.

 

Kaminari Oyaji i may be wrong here but i think i read somewhere kano practiced aikido as well as jujitsu

Wouldent it be funny if all the guys who do judo and bash akido where to find out it was founded by someone who was a practitioner. /versus/images/graemlins/laugh.gif

 

(And yes, there is no asian person in the world/has ever existed in the world that can beat crocop in a fight (ok, i guess it depends on whether you believe in the legend of kimura or maybe choi controlling him in a weird way which would actually be cool to see). lol man i almost do sound closed minded -- but it's really just common sense.)

WOW racisem to mate your going for gold arent you.


(Honestly man, you think that video posted shows guys with any actual skill whatsoever? Are you kidding me? ) That video if you botherd to read my blog by it on youtube was of two novices in kung fu.

If you bothered to read the blog i said They lacked much skill but they fougt about the same as chuck lindel or crocop just they arent huge muscle men.

Wu chan lam only trained for a few weeks in ving tsun before that fight.

That video was to show you smart areses that claim that we dont get "WET" that we infact do.

(And you're correct, fighting based around theory is bullshit. )- Are you serious?

Name one style in existence that doesnt have a scienctifical theory behind it,

NAME ONE!

 

[ QUOTE ]
vanity said:

And srider, interestingly enough i would say that it does ring true for ground grappling -- but in standup combat (which most TMA applies to) it's far more about strength/aggression/good timing than thinking "alright so if he goes for a cross i do this". TMA nuthuggers will watch a fight with a TMA practitioner, and then when the guy loses will say, "well he should have done this". Those people need to get in the ring and understand that when you take a shot to the jaw your world changes.

[/ QUOTE ]

Exactly. I completely agree with that, which holds true for MMA as well. Thus validating the argument that practioners of TMA has just as much chance of winning don't you agree? Practice grappling all you want but take a shot in the face by some bruce lee wanna be and see what happens, or worse, get poked in the eye. I'm not arguing for either side, but UFC is so obviously geared towards grappling, it doesn't take a monkey to figure that out. Take out the rules of tapping out, let them break each other's arms, and see if people want to grapple in UFC.

 

[ QUOTE ]
Evil_Pai said:

Kaminari Oyaji i may be wrong here but i think i read somewhere kano practiced aikido as well as jujitsu

Wouldent it be funny if all the guys who do judo and bash akido where to find out it was founded by someone who was a practitioner. /versus/images/graemlins/laugh.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

Yes, your right about judo being based from jujitsu. It was one of the first things I learned in taking judo.
http://www.judoinfo.com/kano4.htm

Read down further about Masatomo Iso his instructor that was only 5 feet tall. I give major props for a person of this size taking on giants and throwing them like rag dolls about the dojo with maximum efficiency minimum effort.

 

Can someone give dude a rock to hit himself over the head with.

 

(TMA nuthuggers will watch a fight with a TMA practitioner, and then when the guy loses will say, "well he should have done this". )
- I dont mean to be making excuses here but one always has to ask the credability of such displays.
Im not talking about the ufc but rather the kinds of videos that end up on bullshido.

Martial arts propaganda is nothing new.
So lets do the run down.

Here is an example of the sort of thing vanity is talking about. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ABqD8Odaebw

Now im not an expert of all kung fu but i have been into it for a very long time and other than wushu dancing i have never seen a style that would do something so stupid and leave your side wide open like this.

But then again i dont know all kung fu.

Then we have this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TjXUCjLgyis

Now i have never done karate in my life and sure it looks like shotokan but how do i know this guy isnt just some hobo off the street in a gi who they paid to fight like a moron. I mean just what the hell is he doing here?

Its as if he moves his arm to make it look like a punch and just leaves it there limp makes alot of noise but dosent actualy seem to throw a real strike not to mention he charges right in carlessly like some robot.

What real fighter would ever do anything even remotly like this?

But again i have never done karate so i wouldent know.

Then we go back to the origonals the japanese who during bruce lee's popularity suffered so they made propaganda.

Now anyone here is welcome to go onto either google video or youtube and search sil lim tao the form this moron is doing at the start.
It dosent matter who you get because even the worst ving tsun practitioners dont look this bad.

Its painfuly obvious they are making this guy look like a girl. Its quite insaulting but its a pethetic attemt to discredit ving tsun.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QH13kYFzfFk

And now to show you all how unbias i am i will show you fake ving tsun challenge matches that try to make ving tsun look good. OR rather wing tsunTM.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=89tLmoCtjPc

This is so obviously faked.

Theres another one two but i cant find it. Its even worse looks like something you see off tekken 4.

So dont give me this crap about how we are humiliated my persional experience has been quite the opposite.

 

(Read down further about Masatomo Iso his instructor that was only 5 feet tall. I give major props for a person of this size taking on giants and throwing them like rag dolls about the dojo with maximum efficiency minimum effort. )- Hehe pretty cool

 

(Exactly. I completely agree with that, which holds true for MMA as well. Thus validating the argument that practioners of TMA has just as much chance of winning don't you agree? Practice grappling all you want but take a shot in the face by some bruce lee wanna be and see what happens, or worse, get poked in the eye. I'm not arguing for either side, but UFC is so obviously geared towards grappling, it doesn't take a monkey to figure that out. Take out the rules of tapping out, let them break each other's arms, and see if people want to grapple in UFC.)

Srider your quite right in your point but our argument is not so much grappling vs striking as it is mma vs tma grappling is a traditional martial art to you know chinese chi na is very old and its what changed into japanese jujitsu.

The argument is more of wether if a style dosent compete in competition is it redered redundant.
I persionaly think the argument ridiculous.

Sparing is good it makes you stronger and teaches you how to react under pressure.

But you can spar a billion times and not be prepared for a real fight.

Plus half of self defense should be placed on how to look out for trouble not just fighting.

And im not talking about talking your way out of trouble either . Im talking about learning to notice the sly of some guys hand as you enter an elevator because if you wait until he pulls out the knife your already dead,

 

Back to the original question!

[ QUOTE ]
Poppa said:

I'm very interested in reading into the philosophy and history of different fighting styles such as Aikido and Ninjitsu (among others). I was wondering if you guys had any books you would recommend? They could be books about any fighting style.

If it also has some basic exercises, that would be great as well. Stuff that I could do at home to give me a feel for it.

[/ QUOTE ]

If you fancy having a look at the various formats of Wing Chun there is a site that holds much information and links many other related sites.

www.wcarchive.com/

As far as the rest of this thread is concerned it seems to be more about clash of personality rather than a serious discussion. Wing Chun has suffered from bad publicity over the years and there has been a growth of Wing Chun getting involved in NHB competition and the attitude that Wing Chun needs to stand up and be counted in real fighting.

www.everythingwingchun.com/everything-wing-chun-fighters-s/131.htm

My understanding of Wing Chun is that it is the simple straightforward application of personal body mechanics related to violent confrontation. /versus/images/graemlins/cool.gif

 

*enters thread*

/versus/images/graemlins/shocked.gif

Well, thanks a lot guys for the book recommendations and links to sites. I'm busy with school exams right now, but as soon as I'm done, I'm most definitely checking them all out.

 

I find it quite funny how people join a virtua fighter forum just to discuss martial arts and not VF /versus/images/graemlins/frown.gif .. anyways. /versus/images/graemlins/smile.gif

@Evil_Pai (good name choice, she is evil lol) ,

correct me if I'm wrong but is your argument/point that TMA are still valid?
I'm sure most people with any sense are open minded to things,
but you really can't expect people to believe what someone says about it without evidence.
With MMA people can see it's effectiveness as showcased on the various mma shows,
they can practise it in Live training/sparring sessions with a resisting opponent and see it's effectiveness,
with the TMA's not so much,
so to be fair what conclussion do you expect people to come to here?

If it's the attitude/point of "I don't need to prove it's effectivness", then it's also not worth arguing about it , is it really?
Just be happy knowing what you believe to be true and others can do the same,
since it's not gonna change either way unless hard evidence breaking either sides beliefs come to light.
No matter how well written/argued words aint gonna suffice in this instance.


p.s (Don't mean this to be offensive,
but hinted at earlier ,
maybe you can run your posts through WORD spell check before you post as it's difficult to read your words as some of them use incorrect spelling,
it seems your passionate about this subject when your writing but typing fast leads to errors,
which leads to people switching off when they can't read your posts, thx)