Dead or Alive 5 Announced for 2012! PS3 and Xbox

she needs to learn her poke game. High lev DOA has a huge poke game, The online spamers will thin out as she gets better. Her best option right now is block and poke to death and throw punish. Once she figures this out she will be getting all kinds of hate mail lol. Who is she using currently. FSD has a lot of tips and new stuff gets posted everyday. Even the Pai thread has been looking up the past few days.
Also the only net code patch should be out soon. Hopefull in the next week or so.

the 4 point give the attacker better odds for damaging then an 3 point. Also most combo stings in DOA can be delayed longer then the active frames on a hold. Then theres even free canceling which adds a whole new lev.

 

I know, but mid-specific punch and mid-specific kick, to me that's a little too specific for a reversal. Not arguing any of your points, but I'm just saying they nerfed it in a direction that I'm not sure is as fun.

 

Mid attacks are the most important and common ones. Having one button to hold all of them is overkill. If you stun someone and want to launch, now you and have to guess between the person holding mid or something else (either low or high does not matter). It basically reduces the offensive game to a 50/50 guess, because low holds go under highs. By having 3-point the defender is basically in the same position as the attacker.
By splitting the mid hold into mid kick and mid punch, the defender has a 1/3 chance of randomly guessing correctly while the one on the offense has 2/3 of a chance to land a successful attack.

As for it being intuitive, it's just a matter of practice, and by it being this way it's less encouraging to just spam the mid hold all the time, which is exactly what is needed.

 

Heh...thanks, I will be sure to pass on that information.
She seems to be flipping between Tina and Kokoro in DOA.

Maybe I should do some local two player with her, play the part of spammer, so that way she can get practice on how to deal with that.
Of course, that WOULDN'T help accounting for online lag though...

 

Is there a list of common combos? Also who is the best pokey character?

 

fsd has threads for each character with combos, Most spammers just hit the standard PPPP or KKKK combos which all can be punished if you block all. Jann Lee, Kokoro, Bass, Baymen, Tina are the best at poke and punish. Hayabusa is more crush then pokes but could still be considered good at the poke/throw game.

CodyHunter-tinas bust pokes at 8p which gives a free low throw if it hits, 1p crush and goes under most high and some mids. She needs to learn the timing on spammers. This will will help a lot. 2P is also good, 6H+K is good at range and allows a free ground grab is they dont tech. Also Tinas SS+k is best in the game. Goes under almost everything and her 1k is almost as good.
Kokoro is stun heavy. Her best poke is 66P with a stun and can be followed up. 6k is good as a poke as well. 236 is another great poke and has distance and sit down stun. Both SS+p/k are great, The SS+P has stun. When is comes to spammers her best thing is to punish or poke from distance. She doesn't have many crushes that will help agaist spammers

also she can use the training room with the network speed turned down to 1 bar to help her with timing

 

You can set the game to simulate lag in training mode, and player 2 can join in training mode as well.

 

Im actually enjoying doa5.

 

Looking back on the last handful of pages, if a person is hung up on the exact frame counts, meaning they wanna use a 17 frame attack on -17 on block, then they'll never accept doa for what it is... for two reasons:

1. it's the cynics explaination. Does anyone honestly play VF by applying that specific frame counts in an actual game? Executing in the dojo is one thing, applying the math to a real game is a different ordeal. Is anyone really blocking an attack and thinking "ok, that was -17 on block... now I shall unleash my 17 frame kick because the mathematic formula is perfect!" I doubt it. Everyone has their bnb counter pokes and launchers, and they use them within the confines of the frame counts. They're not flipping through the rolodex in their minds and pulling out an attack that matches the negative frames on block.

2. doa isn't about the "my turn, your turn" formula of VF. The same bnb counters are used over and over in VF, so long as the frame window allows it, meaning the same elbow, the same launcher. That mindset gets you destroyed in doa, because any good player will recognize the same response from the same situation and hold it. I set my rank limit online to S+ because I wanted to see how top players played. I played an S+ that used Mila and retaliated with a two hit low kick after blocking her. Shortly after in the same round, I did the same thing... and the second low kick was held, I ended up on the ground, he/she did a ground attack which causes my character to auto standup, and then I was crushed with a combo before I even realized my character was standing up without my consent.

So, what does that mean? It means the frame count in doa is merely a guideline, and that's all it's intended to be, because having the frame advantage in a fighting game simply means you can attack first... but in doa, that doesn't guarantee you anything. And it's meant to be that way.

Frame advantage strikes are not the punishers. Throws are. Shitty players spam the hold function. Throw out two jabs, pause, watch them whiff a hold, then destroy it with a throw that is now granted 150% damage. Again, the theme here are throws. There is a 28 point window once a character is stunned for you to pass that threshold with your CB attack. The cynic will say the stunned opponent will just guess your attack and hold it... the reality is, unless you're CONSTANTLY doing the same attacks in that situation, it's extremely difficult to guess right. Look at the course of a match... which attacks are successfully held? The first strike... or the third/fourth hit in a combo? The answer is the latter, because you're anticipating where the back end of a combo is going to hit. Good luck trying to hold individual attacks that conflict with the four point hold system... that's what you're doing against a stunned opponent. Two or three individual strikes to set up the CB attack. Like someone else mentioned here... you have to learn when to SLOW DOWN.

VF is the superior game, but DoA is still a great game that has much more strategy than the cynics realize. You just have to go into it with a clean slate.

I have one quick positive and one quick negative about doa to mention in the infancy of my time spent online:

I love playing someone that truly is watching how I play and holds my attack that I threw out one time too many. I think to myself, "you sly bastard..."

I despise playing the faggots that spend the entire match running to the opposite end of the ring and doing nothing except waiting for you to run after them, or they just charge back in with a diving attack. They constantly are just trying keeping a mile between you and play the counter game. Faggots. All of them.

 

psn patch is out and so far the word is netcode is good! Still waiting on the xbl patch

 

Your 1st point. Frames help in picking your offense and flow charts. You don't think in the match, of what the frames are as you are supposed to already know them, but knowing it helps to build a foundation so when you play you can flow with it. This applies to DOA except now that it's known frames are off you can come up with correct punisher.

The 2nd point is why the cynics dont like it. It comes down to the Holds and the Stun. Did my stun land? Yes. Keep pressing the advantage. Did it get Held? I'm on the defensive, waiting for my turn. I Hold. Did it land? Yes, now I'm on the offensive. No, I'm still on the defensive.
Before that it's the spacing and whiff punishing game.


Now I'm not going to knock DOA for that but that's how every other fighter pans out, since every fighter is turned base, it's just in VF, it happens at a lot faster pace and with more options to making for a more interesting game. The spacing and whiff punishing part is in VF too, but it's easier to engage the enemy than in 2D/Tekken/DOA.

 

Yeah if there's one thing I dislike about DOA it's this... It's too easy to just turtle. A lot of Jann Lee players do this and they think they're better players for it. Nothing but cowards... I can often get the best of them thankfully, but it still annoys me.

 

not only do VF players who are good all play this way, the game is built around this idea. IE most people have a 14 frame high to punish -14 frame attacks (most of which seem to now be -15, to further encourage this system). once you're familiar with the general rule set of how this works, it becomes 2nd nature: basic low kicks usually =14/15, heavy low attacks -17+ etc... you don't have to count frames in-match, you just apply these rules.

 

So.. What did you guys think of the last patch?

 

Improved the online tremendously!

 

Team Ninja asked for feedback so they can include it in the next patch, so, if you want something fixed, here's your chance:

https://twitter.com/TeamNINJAStudio/status/260715238779920385

https://twitter.com/TeamNINJAStudio/status/260715383558905856

 

I submitted a few suggestions.

1. I would like an additional online search criteria. Search by connection quality. Tired of being paired with 1's and 2's in simple/ranked matches.

2. For simple/ranked matches, the option to accept or reject. If the connection is bad, no use trying to play through it.

3. Bring back LORELEI stage from DOA3.

 

Just got the game. Any links to great resources for a relative noob like me? Last time I played DoA was 2. Thanks.

 

To be honest, the prima official game guide is the best resource as of now. If you can spare the money, it's probably worth getting. On the two main forums for DOA, there hasn't really been any well-written guide for beginners afaik.

 

And this post sums up why I will probably stop playing DOA5 after NEC. You just can't get people to block no matter what you do. I'm so tired of playing against Helena, Lei Fang, Kasumi, etc (to many to name) who just refuse to block. And if they aren't blocking they are spamming holds which can't be punished by a decent normal move on recovery. I hit people, know they are going to hold, I wait, hold comes, I try to punish, I get spammed out by PPP strings. Honestly I think people mash more in DOA5 than they did in DOA4.

Also the DOA ground game is just plain silly because some characters like Helena can just abuse it to know end with combos that force you to tech roll only to be put right back down into the same situation again and again. They should have implemented a system like Tekken where you could stay grounded if you choose and no attack can hit you for a short period of time. I forgot how it works, but I know in Tekken you can hold down or something after a knock down and your character just lays there dead as a nail so you can safely get up.


I hate to say it, but I enjoyed DOA4 more at the moment. DOA5 has many, many great things going about it, but the game seriously needs to be balanced some more. The one thing I hate the most is this punishing by throw only bullshit. If someone commits to a sweep and I block it why can't I launch or get guaranteed damage other than a throw? You got high punches that look like mids, mids that look like high punches, back turned mid punches which actually hit low.... *sigh* let me stop here.

Some high level play for ya!

Check out Helena's ridiculous ground game. Sadly not every character can do bullshit like this. And check out what the other play tries to do from time to time to combat against her BS when he gets tired of dealing with it. HOLD HOLD HOLD HOLD HOLD... If you can spam hold that fast then what has changed since DOA4? Nothing! And it just fucks my mind to see people get hit or get there shit blocked and they just keep tapping those attack buttons. It's like someone said in a previous post, it's most likely they don't play any other fighting game because you can't play any other fighting game like this.