Goh Strategy (Flow, Setups, Combos etc)

after a shoulder stagger the best option for a throw is the half catch throw as it has the most range then you can follow it with another shoulder.

If they start catching on to that and duck, low throw. If they are more aggressive and try to attack out of the stagger the , hit throw is a great option. The elbow makes characters respect the mid attack, and allows for a throw game once again. They might start becoming defensive again then dash in 270 throws are fun.

Or the is another good mid move. That can force a crouch into another low throw. A small dash is usually required.

 

<font color="#ff3366">after a shoulder stagger the best option for a throw is the half catch throw as it has the most range then you can follow it with another shoulder.</font>

A better option is Goh's ++. It can be done from a crouch dash, and gives Goh an opportunity for a ground throw. Actually, following with any throw is good.

Another followup can be attacking with Goh's +, or maybe ++ if they duck. Both give Goh nice combos if they hit, and are uncounterable if blocked (++ hits mid, and Goh steps back a bit, so it may avoid the low punch). You can also follow with another shoulder ram (++). If it's blocked, it's throw counterable only, so input the throw escapes.

re: UNCONKABLE
A lot of good beginner flow charts are in CreeD's Goh quickstart guide, in case you missed it. I think a lot of the questions you asked can be answered in it.

 

yeah, what ghostdog said... read the goh guide. Some other answers -

Just curious as to what other Goh players are using?

His best throw, if you can do it without screwing up, is his 270 (roll +). If you try it and screw up, it usually turns into the HCF+ throw you like, which is quite strong.

re - ... this move is actually very slow by VF standards - 23 frames. I've seen it used by high level goh players, but it has a major weakness: The opponent can simply backdash out of any attack or throw followup you try. So even if you get +2 on MC, it's not enough stun to force them into a useful guessing game. The only way to punish their backdash is another /versus/images/graemlins/frown.gif
Basically you should only use it if the opponent doesn't know the backdash trick and keeps trying to attack after they get hit by it. If they attack afterwards, a shoulder ram will usually win over anything.

Are there any good followups after the backstagger? seems that I can only land a f,f+P and that is shitty.

That about sums it up. A shitty f,f+P. The backstagger reward is so small that the opponent really doesn't need to fear a backstagger too much against goh. Your alternative is to dash in with a guessing game - if they turn around and guard, throw... and if they turn around and attack, hit throw. If they turn around and crouch guard... that's a toughie. Standing I guess.

After a shoulder ram, I think the bottom line for good followups is either dash and throw or dash into f,f+P hit throw. A lot of players beat people who struggle and attack with the hit throw also.

If my opponent backrolls, what is the disadvantage?

By backroll do you mean they're lying down for a second, then tap b+G to roll away from you? If so there's no reliable followup, just dash forward after them and then play the usual guessing game against rising attacks.
If you mean P+K+G quick rise, that's a straight 50/50 mid-or-throw guessing game. They are not allowed to dodge or attack, but they can guard high or low. So predict which way they will guard and then use throw, low throw, or possibly.

 

Try out this combo rear the wall which work great!!! /versus/images/graemlins/cool.gif

+(rebound) -> + -> ->
+

But 1 problem is that, how do u move ur opp
rear the wall the easy way??? /versus/images/graemlins/confused.gif

 

Just to make sure is the
guarenteed after the throw

because it seems like it is, but ive been seeing a lot of japanese playing not following it up.

 

it's not... I think you need to roll towards his front foot to avoid it. Either that or backroll.

 

Yeah, a backroll will avoid the d/f+P.

 

Don't know if this was already posted but....

After a low punch inashi with +, his + always seems to hit. In this situation it always floats, allowing you to unleash the typical "match-ending" Goh float combo /versus/images/graemlins/smirk.gif. That's the best guaranteed damage that I'm aware of right now. Another (questionable) option is: Instead of going for a regular throw(which will whiff if you do it immediately after the inashi, thereby wasting frames), the opponent appears to be stunned long enough for + + to hit (65 pts damage). That one still needs further testing, but to me it looks like it's guaranteed.

 

Interesting, I may end up revising my guide... b+P+K I'd have thought wouldn't float that high, but it occurred to me to try b,f+P+K for a 60 pt combo.

Anyway, useful bit...I'll play with it some, hope I can add more good stuff to the goh guide.

 

[ QUOTE ]
That about sums it up. A shitty f,f+P. The backstagger reward is so small that the opponent really doesn't need to fear a backstagger too much

[/ QUOTE ]

I've had a lot of luck mixing in the after the shoulder ram... i get a knockdown quite often as they struggle out of the staggar (is there a reason for this here?). Then it seems like I'm able to land a ground throw after the knockdown every time. Is this garunteed?

 

It knocks down because your either getting an MC with it, if your opponent attacks after struggling, or your opponent doesn't know how to struggle effectively and your hitting them while there still in the struggle animation. The ground throw is guaranteed but it can be escaped so a better follow up is P~Shrm or an easy P~K.

 

<font color="yellow"> Thanks for the replies everybody. Actually I read all of CreeD's Goh guide before posting on here. Some of the flows are good, but after trying some of it I got the feeling that you don't get to play a lot of comp that often much like myself. The reasoning is because some of your suggestions look good on paper, but don't space well causing Goh to whiff, or aren't practical against a human opponent. It is definately good for players that are starting out though so keep it up and thanks again.

Also, I have to reiterate that is the juice. Unlike Akira's low backfist, this move has a great built in evade property that causes it to land quite often on counter hit. Also, many times when my opponents evade this, I am too far away and low to the ground for a quick retaliation and once they start going for fast retaliations, I do quick moves in order to block their long lagging moves then take my guaranteed combo or throw guessing game.

Another interesting for you Goh players to try is to have Lau do a straight up hopkick, then do Goh's (the kick that auto-parries some kicks) and if you do this correctly, Lau will freeze standing in mid-air. This happened once during gameplay and then in practice mode we were able to recreate it. I haven't tested whether you can combo off of the frozen airborn Lau, or even if it is Lau specific, but if anybody wants to test this then go for it. This was done on the PS2 Evolution version, not the arcade version.

conk out,
not unstoppable, just...

UNCONKABLE!!!!</font>

 

ha, that lau thing is neat. I wonder if it works with anyone who has a midkick sabaki like lion.. and with that in mind, I wonder if it can be applied to other stuff, like his hop knife or other hop attacks.

 

Been playing goh alot lately, thought i'd share some stuff....

1) Goh is simple when it comes to combos which is always a good attribute for a second main character =P.

2) Goh is a supreme japanese badass!

on to gameplay:

1) Shldr ram: -9 on block, it is actually a good idea to attack again with a quick lp and TE afterwards. If they delay an attack the lp hits and if they throw you input the TE's in time to break atleast 2 throws =). On hit and MC you get ass stagger, If the opponent is one to lp as fast as they can just stick in a long ranged "K" for another stagger, if the opponent isn't a immediate struggler always Crouch dash in, that way an opponent that is good will have to guess. If you dash in its a dead give away your throwing and you'll get Lp'd and if you don't Crouch dash in your opponent will struggle and capitalizing is now not an option. Your best followups for the stagger on a non struggler are CD in and throw or CD in and Shldr ram again. Most of the time a skilled player can struggle and watch to see how you react to the stagger and take away your options =). Whats actually nice is that the shoulder ram has great execution and can beat many lp's but if the opponent gets a successful dodge on your shoulder ram....your screwed!

2) b,f+p, great move for combos, on block ??? DTEG or lp, on hit followup with a mid move such as d/f+p or b+p. on MC jab shldr ram or "K". This move is fast! one of the few fast moves goh possesses.

3) d/f+k knocks down and is a good mid kick. On block its -4 or -5 you can DTEG or attack again.

4) "K" is probably my favorite move with goh, it's got great range and staggers well. This move is what gives goh that edge from a step back!

Tired, heading to bed =) will write more when i can see straight.

 

good stuff blondie. The shrm into shrm into shrm guessing games are really harsh, since shrm has priority over both high and low punches... even in a minus-frames situation.

If you want to really make people cry, b+P+K can beat struggle-and-low-punch after shrm... it helps if the shrm was a long range MC. Look for the chance to land the easy and painful open stance b+P+K -> P -> f+P,P -> ground throw for exactly half their life. Vicious.

f,f+P hit throw is also good after the shrm stagger... though when I think about it, it's like... what, 60 pts for that with no sure followup vs 40 pts if you get another shrm MC and they're ass staggered again.

PS: I gots my goh combo video ready but no way to get it out to everyone... bummer /versus/images/graemlins/frown.gif

 

You're using Goh now? /versus/images/graemlins/shocked.gif

I love the standard , but I think is the absolute hotness. Great range, uncounterable, sabakis high/mid kicks, and crumples on MC. In the "tactics" section of training mode, they recommend or + (towards the opponent's back) if it gets blocked, but I think you can option-select with so many different things in that situation. + ~ DTE owns!!!

BTW, there's some kick-ass Goh stuff here:
http://am.sega.jp/utop/news/vfexh/vfexh_go.html

 

was working on my goh earlier and found some interesting stuff. Goh's throw game is possibly the best i've seen yet. HCF+p+g is nice, 270 +p+g, and ff+p+g are all valid reasons to break forward throw everytime you dodge. That leaves HCB+p+g that does 65 and f,b+p+g that dishes it out also, b+p+g should never be seen unless your trying to move the opponent behind you for a ring out or closer to the wall. Goh's d/f+p+g is nice damage and his d/f,d/f+p+g garauntees a low throw and wall combos, not to mention moves them a great deal in the middle of the ring. That leaves the almighty fourth and fifth throws for you to impose at will =). P+G that does 40 and f,d+p+g( my personal favorite), it leaves you face down head away. Which you all know leaves our opponents in a wonderful Semi-linear rising attack position. From here you either block the low rising and PUNISH! with d/f+p or low throw, or go threw the mid rising with DRE's personal favorite b,f+k for a crushing combo! Cause it sabaki's it! Goh is HOTNESS! when it comes to the throw game.

Goh's catch throw is nothing but deadly, i opt to make my opponent guess up or down initially cause most will mindlessly break forward or back immediately, then i input either same direction again for big damage or forward or back for big damage.

Goh's b,f+k is a GREAT move like DRE said, on block it is uncounterable which can lead to Horrible Goh flowcharting. On hit it leaves goh at an advantagous position to go mid with d/f+p or throw with one of goh's many devastating throws. And last but not least on MC you get SHLDER ram, or i like to mix in f+P+K(slam) suprise ground throw. Oh yeah, I forgot to mention this move has CRAZY range and goes through mid kicks instantly on input. That means you can almost see the mid kick coming and time this move to beat it =).

Another move i like to use from a step back is d/b+k, which leaves the opponent grabbing his ankles and leaves you with a big grin on your face. Question: what kind of stagger does this move give you? I've low thrown out of a MC d/b+k was it garaunteed? or is there a mid/throw guessing game here? d or u P+k gives the same stagger i think, feedback =)!

Goh has two low kicks to control dodging by opponents without committing to throws and full circular roundhouses that are high that give you up too much. d/f+k is semi-circular keeping the opponent from dodging to goh's front and links into a hit throw when it hits on MC with f+p+g. d/b+k+g keeps the opponent from dodging to goh's back and knocks down on MC and on hit( which it will if you use it properly) your left at a slight disadvantage, so DTE for flowcharting or attack to be a badass =P.

That is all for now, I'll write more =) once i know more.

 

Glad to see you agree with me on Goh's awesome throwing game...definitely better than Jeffry's.

And yep, on MC guarantees a low throw! HOTNESS! Also, by the half-circular hit throw you meant [+ right?

 

The hit-throws are nice. I think + is guaranteed after low punch inashi with +. Correct me if I'm wrong, but on MC also guarantees low throws. + forces crouch also, but I'm not too sure about that one.

 

Yep on the first two, and nothing is guaranteed after the +. Still, useful for slam on floats.