Jacky vs.......

Generally you can bait Vanessa in DS to throw out the sabaki's and 9f high for /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/db.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif on mC. It get's trickier in OS cause she can knee your face for shit load of damage but if she goes back to OS then you can go back to good ol Jacky elbow pressure.

Also try and and use /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/b.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/f.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif and maybe a high angle kick now and then against Vanessa in DS when at big advantage. Takes out the fear of the inashi and sabaki.

 

Basically in order for me to keep up with the Bradster i just tried to stand clear of his /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif+/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/g.gif then /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/d.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif+/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/g.gif cause is neutralizes side steps and is normally his most spammed move.
Keeping Mind that when you playing against anybody you must remember to take away strengths and Moves from your opponent. Its almost Brad's sprecialty to crumble you with his spin,slip-ins and outs punches and elbow strikes follow ups. In order to counter this you must make the opponent aware of Jacky most annoying and safe haven of a move..yes the Pak Sao. For some odd reason jacky can Pak Sao Brad spinning elbow attacks. By doing this it will make the opponnent leary of throwing punches leading in off of sways.

 

Block the /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/d.gif/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif+/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/g.gif portion. He'll be at -22, which means as Jacky, you can literally rape him with a big launcher.

 

I'm having trouble against Akira users. Can his elbows be punished on block? I've learned that elbow heel(F + p, k) is a good guarenteed punisher against his double palm...would you say that is the best option of punish? The one move where he does a two hit karate chop move where he hits you with one hand and then turns around and comes down with his other hand...UGH it's hard to sidestep and he's at no disadvantage after it. Plus he can cancel the first hit and do a side shuffle to trick you. I get so lost and usually I'll freeze and eat a launch throw, jab, palm bounce, double palm combo! Big damage YIKES! HELP! It's weird b/c sometimes Jacky was able to pak sao this move on accident! But when I tried to intentionally do it(usually most akira players do this move when the round starts), I get hit!

 

akira 66p+kp is half circular u can evade towards akira stomach side the first attack is a shoulider followed by a mid p. guard the shoulder and remain neutral to pak sao his mid attack. akira dashing elbow 66p if blocked some might low p or evade try a back dash with a beat knuckle . i think u can pk akira 666p after blocked

 

There is no way to get guaranteed punishment on either or akiras elbows. That is why the most important thing you need to do is watch what is happening after you block the opponents elbow and exactly which elbow it is. For example, vs akiras dashing elbow 66p (FFp), akira is at -5 frames disadvantage on block meaning he can fuzzy guard after to beat your mid attack or throw and then get the advantage again. Its a textbook beginner strategy for akira players and can be really annoying if you dont know how to deal with it.

Here are some options after you block akiras dashing elbow (66p) [ffp]...

[[[Dashing Elbow is blocked then opponent tries to block - Throw the opponent]]]

[[[Dashing Elbow is blocked then opponent tries to attack or duck - Attack with a quick mid (elbow or beat knucklke) You have +5 after blocking that elbow and if the opponent tries to attack when you attack here, he gets countered]]]

[[[Dashing Elbow is blocked then opponent tries to fuzzy - Use an iaigeri to keep the adtvantage and apply pressure with an attack or throw after that or make them block string mixups. (Dont try to throw or attack with a one hit move immediately or you'll give the advantage back to your opponent) If the opponent likes to just stand there and block after he fuzzys your attack/throw, you can also try to go for a delay throw]]]


Will finish this post later...

 

Guys I need help against Shun and Lion players! GRRR these guys are the most annoying characters by far. Shun's so damn strong and seems not to have any recovery after most of his moves and Lion's low and mid games are just a pain to deal with.

 

In my experience the hardest characters for Jacky to deal with is Shun and Aoi. Against Shun jacky elbow games aren't as effective against Shun's P+K+G 3/1 and 2k which beats both his throw and elbow mixups and at 10 drinks shun can sabakai most if not all of jacky's moves that involves a mid punch strike ( he has no double handed moves). Against shun try using 4k more instead of 6p and set up his groin kick (46k)

 

I honestly dont have problems with jacky player, Jacky and Goh are the 2 opponents i REALLY keep track of, agains Jacky im 25 and 5, against Goh im 17 and 7 so idk what im doing right, i do alot of Brads heavy damaging attacks so i get you out quick but i will mix it up and mess you up with his combo's and slips

 

I hate Shun b/c he has so many options. He can play keep away and just keep drinking, he can lay low to the ground which is very hard to hit him out of, he has cheap ass counters that lead to high damaging combos, he has throws that lead to mind games and launchers, stun moves as well as easy floaters, and the imfamous kangaroo kick! UGH no wonder you switched to Shun, Denkai. Ugh but I won't give up Jacky for some old fart! BLEH lol! Thanks for the tip...hopefully that'll help change the tide of battle for me alittle.

Yea Aoi is a pain to fight against too(I hate her sweep attack and fast mids and ofcourse her counters) but I actually can do pretty well against her sometimes...whereas w/ Shun, it's like I know I'll lose 90% of the time ugh!

 

Sup HotD. Along with the aforementioned advice, try utilizing 1p, and 46k+g in your game against tricky characters. Shun can get around most of Jacky's offensive options, but 46k+g will "condense the nonsense". It'll force your opponent to deal with that option and in turn will open up opportunities to use Jacky's main striking game with 6p.

It's a difficult matchup. Don't distance yourself too much from Shun because that allows your opponent a free pass to 10+ drink points - not fun. Understand also that some characters are just a pain to deal with online and extra patience is needed if you're experiencing a connection that isn't optimal. You'll want to blame lag/character/balance, but usually its just ignorance.

extra stuff/side note

Mastering the buffer in an online game is more often than not the key to victory.

After 3 or 4 games you and your opponent should have the timing needed for execution and strategy. Ranked match mode is more or less crapshoot so proceed with caution. Most importantly: maintain composure - you have the same chances of success as your adversary.

 

Fighting Vanessa

Having a problem Unsafe Dan mentioned quite some time ago:

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> She is really annoying in that she has many moves she can use a disadvantage that option select A LOT of your basic pressure attacks.</div></div>

I have been getting hit by her retarded little sabakis a lot in +3~+5 situations. fortunately, like shun she has trouble with 4k, so i throw that in the mix and hit check just in case. something else that irks me, i often get tagged when trying to evade her offensive strings, like back knuckle. im used to characters just flying by me while i get to pick my poison. then, after blocking her back knuckle stream, ive been pushed too far back to do anything with my +13, or am i? what do ya'll do?

 

Back knuckles are half circular, they are mostly meant to be ducked, not evaded.

After back knuckle stream do p,k while holding the F button.

Deter your vanessa opponent from using retarded little sabakis by doing jacky's retarded little somersault.

 

p,k on back knuckle stream, got it. thanks. only part to duck in knuckle stream is the kick. guess i have a propensity to evade too often when playing her ><

think ill stick with 4k to deal with sabakis though, trying to stay from somersaults unless guaranteed.

 

Back knuckle stream is a Defensive Stance move. I assumed you were talking about offensive stance backhands. That's why i answered the backhands and the back knuckle stream differently.

I now realise by "offensive" you meant something along the lines of "aggressive" or "fast". I apologize for the confusion.

 

Hey guys now I'm having trouble against Kage lol! Man that bastard has some sick throws and combos and plus he can ring you out so easily w/ various moves! I hate his stance move too...they usually just go into it and hop back and force you to come into them. I'd wait too but Kage is cheap from far distance so I feel like I gotta get close to him and then WHAM! I eat one of his follow up moves. I hate his Down k+g mid kick attack too...can it even be punished? What are some tips? Any good strats?

 

Kage's throws aren't as fearsome as you might think. You only need to be able to do two throw escapes in order to limit most of the threat (those being the back and down directions). If you can get your escapes on those throws down to around a seventy-five percent success rate, then you'll either nullify a lot of damage or force your opponent to switch throws; either way, you're removing most of the threat from TFT ring outs.

As for his 'stances', he has two. The Jumonji stance isn't something you should really fear, as most of the strikes from that stance are moves with sabaki properties, and they're all really slow and can be beaten with moves like /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/b.gif + /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif; /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/f.gif + /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif; or even /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/ub.gif + /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif + /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/g.gif. Make use of those moves to force your opponent into having to use the jab, which you can then either evade or, if you're more confident, use the Pak Sao.

The other stance, Shippou, is more tricky. Most of the time, your opponent will enter the stance from some kind of a small advantage (for example, landing a /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/d.gif + /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif + /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif). Firstly, you need to understand that the hit box of Kage is dramatically reduced when he's in this stance; high moves, and a lot of mid moves, will simply whiff whilst he's in this stance. If your opponent backs away and/or remains neutral whilst in this stance, I find the low backfist ( /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/db.gif + /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif) to be a good way to interrupt the attack; it strikes low, where the evasive properties of the stance are not effective, and it has a lot of range, so it will follow Kage if he jumps backwards.
Now, be careful when you use this, as you'll get smacked in the teeth if Kage attacks upon entering the stance (which he should be doing as he has the advantage); the low backfist is only to be used if your opponent constantly tries to bait you into whiffing a move.

To deal with the strikes, you're looking at making a couple of defensive choices. Evading can work, (as long as you evade away from the half-circular mid strike), as it'll beat the two stomach chops as well as the jab. However, evade will get beaten by the low sweeps and the catch throw. To beat these, you can crouching guard, which will cover both options (of course, then you're open to a mid level chop).

So, what should you do? Firstly, don't do the same thing over and over. There's no perfect defence to beat everything, so don't become predictable. Secondly, punish Kage for making the wrong choice. I find the Pak Sao to be very useful here, because it will counter both the chops as well as the jab, and give the advantage immediately back to you. Also, because you're not pressing anything, you're free to react more quickly to either the catch throw or the low sweeps, and try to crouching guard upon seeing these moves. By using the Pak Sao, you should discourage your opponent from overusing the chops and jabs, which, hopefully, should force him into taking higher risks (such as the aforementioned catch throw and low sweeps). Both of these moves are punishable, and you should make sure to follow up on this.

From here, you're turning the tables on Kage, by forcing them either to risk relinquishing the advantage due to having their chop/jab Pak Sao'ed, or forcing them to risk a highly punishable move (catch throw/low sweeps).

Of course, you can't always just stand there like a lemon waiting for the Pak Sao, so mix up with some different tactics, like evading, crouching guard, and even plain old standing guard. The main issue with Shippou is that the jabs and chops are all safe on guard; there's no guaranteed punish after guarding them, so by using the Pak Sao to reverse them, hopefully, you'll remove your opponent's desire to overuse them, which turns the situation into a much riskier one for Kage.


As for /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/d.gif + /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif + /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/g.gif, it's definitely a pain in the arse. It has huge range, is half-circular and mid level, knocks down on any hit, is safe on guard (-8), does one-eighth of your total HP on normal hit, and is pretty fast at 16 frames. Yes, this move is annoying. However, you can try to discourage your opponent from using it by learning to evade the right way. Because it's half-circular, evading the right way will take you much further around your opponent, leaving him open to a lot of punishment.

Also, because not many of his other moves have as much range as /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/d.gif + /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif + /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/g.gif, it's pretty much the only strike about which you should be concerned when you're at such a distance that the range of that move is an issue.

You can also try to combat it with /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/f.gif /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/f.gif + /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif, which has the same range, but is one frame faster than Kage's /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/d.gif + /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif + /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/g.gif. Another tactic is to bait your opponent into whiffing the kick, and then to move in and punish this.

All in all, the worst thing you can do against Kage is to allow fear to prevent you from doing things, because this will lead to him getting away with many things that should be punished.

 

Awesome...very helpful. LOL love your quote. I feel the same!

 

You'd get along with Shang...

 

Leave poor shang alone!