KOF XIII Announced

I honestly think this game looks worse every time I watch vids of it.

 

Why? I think it looks great particularly the stages and am glad they removed the zoom feature and made the game more like KOF 2002. Having played a lot more of KOF 2002UM 12 does seem like a big step back. Traditional KOF basics are in 12 but it feels lacking in comparison also not sure about the deadlock or clash systems and throws really needed changing. I did like the CD charge though

XIII does have it's problems and I don't like some of these overly long combos but if the reports are true then they could be supporting the game with updates over time.

I really like the look of Duolon's offensive pressure and speed
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DNDfbWosv1o&feature=relmfu#t=6m30s

 

XII was made to bring a new audience in, seeing as SF4 dumbed their system down to make it accessible to newcomers (same with Arcsys). I personally liked the clash system, because characters still took damage, but it can also force alot of players to actually mix their game up instead of constant SF2 Ryu strats or CvS2 Cammy strats (I'm a CvS2 Cammy player btw). The counter hit system was kinda cool too, because it didn't mean an instant knockdown...

My beef with XIII is the stages, in which I think there's not enough of, but at this point I don't care. I'm glad they're not tweaking anything as of yet to keep it in sync with the arcade... I don't think K' and Raiden aren't really that hard to beat... I remember back when UMK3 dropped, and everybody was sweating Ermac, Smoke, and Human Smoke because they had consistant rushdowns and combos outta this world... I still crush those cats with good ole Jax and Reptile, and even Sonya from time to time. If you know your character and you know what you can (and will) expect from your opponent, you shouldn't have to worry about matchups (that's why I don't believe in counter picking)...

Yeah Duolon is one of the characters who has gone through a massive amounts of changes since his debut in 2k3... I personally liked him in XI because while his custom combo was beefed up, but way harder to do, he was more balanced and seemed to have better mixup options. Now he's kinda like a Dhalsim with a more rushdown theme (imo its the complete opposite of Billy Kane's generic strat)... I hate the fact that his string can only be done from a standing C however... I'm not sure if that has changed since XII...

The long combos aren't to bad imo... I think that, and EX moves, are what make the lower to low/mid tier characters more deadly... It's kinda like how in T6 every character could now do substantial damage, especially off of a low parry, which for many characters wasn't possible in the previous Tekkens. That kinda makes the playing field somewhat even... Some EX moves can also be used instead of the traditional GCD attack, and for some that can lead to a combo...

 

Why? I think in a way your post contains the reason why:

The game looks like KOF2002.

2002! this is one of those moments when I somehow feel closer to those trolls who claims that VF5 animations are no better than VF1 and VF is stuck in the 90's.

KOF20002 was old, and ugly, in 2002. It was obsolete the moment it came out. KOF has not displayed an ounce of quality since KOF98 (KOF01 being weird, but better than the others).

KOF13 looks like a clone of past games. even BB is somehow a bigger step forward from GG than KOF13 is to KOF02.

If you are happy to play the same shit all over again, fine. I am not.

 

Have you played the game? It's apparently more like 2002 but doesn't have exactly the same feel and there are new mechanics. I've spoken to people who've played it including Gunsmith from that podcast Jinxhand linked and the difference between 02 and XIII sound like something akin to VF4 (2001) to VF5 and the vids aren't doing the graphics justice. Admittedly there are also issues that need fixing too.

What did SF4 do? It tried to copy the core game of SF2 which is much older than KOF2002. 02 has a lot of great mechanics that were taken out of XII (BC mode which adds depth to comboing and new dimensions to some moves, guard rolls and cancels, max 2 supers and throw priority) and replaced with things that didn't seem to compensate. I do agree though that instead of completely removing every brand new element of XII they could have tweaked and retained at least 1 of them.

 

BB is NOT a step forward in any way. Its a different game.

Besides there's nothing actually wrong with 2k2, its a good game and still gets played to this day for a reason.

Its all personal taste tho.

 

The only other game that gets equal amount of play other than 98 IS 2002!!! That one was considered the most balanced KoF without the whole meter select... Being that their newest project, XIII, is similar to 2002, people are playing it now... The HD combos in XIII alone are one of the many things that makes it stand apart from the previous KOFs... I don't understand how its not a step forward in your eyes at all... I'm pretty sure if you were in France or some other area that had the game, you'd be thinking differently I guess... Some people can see how different and better it is, and others might have to actually play it...

That's funny that you think BB is a step forward from GG, when alot of people especially GG vets feel its the complete opposite. And aside from what some think, its a different game altogether... It's like Samurai Shodown and Last Blade...

And how does a new game with redrawn sprites (with new animations) look like a old game that used rehashed sprites with old animations??? That's like saying MK9 looks the same as UMK3...

 

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">And how does a new game with redrawn sprites (with new animations) look like a old game that used rehashed sprites with old animations???</div></div>

I guess a new game with new animations will feel like an old game when it plays like a 10 years old game.

let me make an example, and see if we can get somewhere with this. lets compare KOF to VF, even if its really stupid.

So VF5 added clash and OM P/K, which were removed in R.

Was R a retread of pre-VF5 games? not really. the removal of clash and the removal of OM attacks were integrated by new gameplay changes that made the game completely different from other VF's.

KOF on the other hand is stuck in the past. this is what happens when developers make games for the fans only.
No point in drawing new sprites if those sprites are used exactly like the old sprites. time for KOF to take a break and SNK come up with a better though out system I think. skip the abomination that KOF13 is and lets get straight to MOTW2.



<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">BB is NOT a step forward in any way. Its a different game.

Besides there's nothing actually wrong with 2k2, its a good game and still gets played to this day for a reason.
</div></div>


Exactly my point. 2k2 may be a good game, but its time for a different game. KOF is dead to me, until they come up with a different game.

This is not a problem for KOF only (see the Silent Hill series for example), but KOF is the worse example. Despite my dislike for GG, you have to applaud ASW for their balls (HNK & Basara X). at least they try. SNK (like Konami)stopped trying.


I own 02 on the DC, PS2 and XBOX (emulated)03 on xbox and PS2, XI on the PS2. TBH I rather have my balls kicked in than play any of those games again.

Hey on a positive note, Neo Witches XBLA looks good! (and Cave's Nin2-Jump looks even better!)

 

KOF and VF imo are exactly the same minus the fact that one is 2d and the other's 3d... They're both very deep games that takes skill to be good in and they're both underrated...

Anyway, the exact same thing you're explaining with regards to VF SNK did the exact same thing with KOF... Some things were taken away, but it plays totally different than the other KOFs. There's obviously a ton of things that make it stand apart from even both versions of KOF2002 (OG & UM); in fact, SNK themselves said they came up with the HD aspect so players can be creative with their combos (that's not like anything in the past if you ask me). Real talk, alot of people didn't like the changes made in KOF99-2001 (thanks to Eolith), so that's why in KOF2002, the system was basically a revamped 98 system with additions, and the players were really digging the game... 2003, and XI got a little buzz, but they don't get as much love as 98 and 2002. These are the players, not the fans who are on these games... Why else do you think they made UM versions of 98 and 2002 and beefed the hell out of it and added other characters to it??? Why else do you think they're making a Final Edition for both games and are constantly balancing it??? They're not doing this for 2001, 2003, XI or even NeoWave. 98 and 2k2 are their best selling games, and they're featured in quite a few tournaments all over Asia, France, and both Latin and South America. If XI was really popular, I'm pretty sure SNK would've had a new version of it already. But its not so hot like it was in 2005/2006.. But as it stands, KOFXIII, 2k2UM, and 98UM are what's happening, hence the first 2 being featured in Tougeki also...

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> no point in drawing new sprites if those sprites are used exactly like the old sprites. time for KOF to take a break and SNK come up with a better though out system I think. skip the abomination that KOF13 is and lets get straight to MOTW2.</div></div>

But didn't Capcom do the exact same thing with SF4, and even MvC3???? I mean all the original SF characters have the same moves with the same animation and maybe the same amount of frames(?) but they're all done in 3d. They didn't even advance their systems, they dumbed them down, especially in SF4... But both games get tons of play, regardless of how many people "hate" the game(s)... So with that said, did they even hate the game to begin with???

SNK doesn't have money to blow like Capcom, so they're only gonna do what the players want. They have an all or nothing approach, so granted they learned their mistakes from XII, so with XIII, they're putting their whole arm in the project and in turn, its been getting good feedback from players all over the world... We just released a podcast on Dreamcancel.com and the top US KOF XIII players were breaking the game down, showing how different it was from all the other KOFs... I'm telling you, looks are deceiving...

MOTW2 was last mentioned 75% completed... They mentioned some things with regards to using their new technology with the game, so I'm thinking the graphics are gonna get the XII treatment as well... Either way, I'm sure some original characters are to return, and once XIII drops, they can start cracking on that project...

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">2k2 may be a good game, but its time for a different game. KOF is dead to me, until they come up with a different game.

This is not a problem for KOF only (see the Silent Hill series for example), but KOF is the worse example. Despite my dislike for GG, you have to applaud ASW for their balls (HNK & Basara X). at least they try. SNK (like Konami)stopped trying.</div></div>

You hate GG??? I take it you liked KOFs 99-2001 for their systems over the original KOF style right??? Either that, or you just hate SNK for no real reason... What are your thoughts about SF and the changes they've made???

 

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">We just released a podcast on Dreamcancel.com and the top US KOF XIII players were breaking the game down, showing how different it was from all the other KOFs... I'm telling you, looks are deceiving... </div></div>

OK, Im going to check it out, I might learn stuff that makes me change my mind.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">You hate GG??? I take it you liked KOFs 99-2001 for their systems over the original KOF style right??? Either that, or you just hate SNK for no real reason... What are your thoughts about SF and the changes they've made???
</div></div>

Imo, KOF94-98 showed a clear progression. After 98, it feels like something changed internally at SNK and the quality of the game went to shit. they are still playable, but instead of evolving, they regressed. IMO GG took the crown from KOF, and KOF went combo happy to regain popularity. When 30 hits combos became the norm, I just yawned.

I am not an hardcore player, I am a fan who bought all of SNK games because I love 2D and I want to show my support. but SNK keep shooting itself in the foot, what with the strikers and with the minimal testing and the infinites and the imbalance.

You ask me why I think they keep remaking the same games? well...because those games were not the best they could have been when they came out I guess. do you remember 02 when it came out? I remember comparing 02 backrounds to 95/96 and thinking "well this is really poor".

SNK should have adopted new tech at some point, they stayed with their board and made games that were old the day they came out. Its no surprise they went balls up.

I dont hate SNK for no real reason. I love KOF12 to bits. to me it was a breath of fresh hair. no long combos! universal parries! clash! finally SNK had the guts to make some substantial changes. but took it all away.

what do I think of SSF4? I dont play the game, or MVC3, because I tried and I dont like the style and the gameplay. I think they are good games. I am not sure why they dont appeal to me as much as others.

IMO, the important thing about SSF4 is that it appeals to people beyond the hardcore players, and there is enough there to entice all types of gamers.

Now I understand that I'm the minority, but I really, REALLY had hopes for an evolution of KOF12 system into something that would allow newcomers and experts to have fun. KOF13 for me is a kick in the nuts. its like SNK saying "fuck you, Im going back to my ex". I am soooo disappointed, and thats why I keep trolling this thread.


EDIT: I just checked one of your vids, this is the kind of stuff that makes me want to forget that KOF ever existed after 98. IMO K' and Kula design dont even fit with pre-99 characters.

 

Raiden is looking beastly, I heard they aint toning down that drop kick either. Can not wait to get my grubby mits all over this

 

K' got his design from a character named Cool who was in a little unknown fighter called Daraku Tenshi: The Fallen Angels... They made some modifications to the outfit, and made him to be a more appealing but rugged version of Kyo with his own style... This was also to fit the NEST Chronicles story line that was introduced in KOF99... From there, the other characters were kinda built around him I believe... Strangely enough, people clung to K' and dropped Kyo altogether for the most part...

Personally, I'm glad the character designs are vastly different. Granted, it might show how old a particular character is based on the story line they were introduced, but SNK wasn't afraid to make changes to some characters either. Think about how many times both Kyo and Athena changed outfits. Both Ralf and Clark basically got beefed up, aesthetically speaking, and I feel that while it was a drastic change, it fits them as if they should've been like that from jump... Sie Kensou is never the same character in terms of movesets and now in appearance... SNK could've made a game with all "shotos" and they all would somehow be vastly different in appearance and in move properties/animations imo... That's one of the things that makes SNK stand out...

 

Yeah I like the fact there not afraid to reinvent a character's fighting style or to just give them some different/new options to change up their playstyle. It's deflating in SF4 to see most returning characters have the almost the same moveset they had in SF2. When will Guile learn a new special FFS?

Gai Tendo was mentioned earlier in this thread as an awsome character and having recently tried him out in XI I have to agree. He's very unique and interesting and the only other character who's anything like him in any fighter I know is Angel. I've also been impressed with Momoko, Oswald and Shion in XI. Shion in particuar's got great animations.

Characters I most want to return
Gai Tendo
Shion (balanced out)
Chizuru
Jhun
Vanessa
Ramon
Geese (98um EX)

I'll be looking out for them as XIII gets it's updates for console. I think they would add a lot of variety and uniqueness to the playstyles that are there.

 

He was extremely fun to play as in cvs2 as well, glad to see him getting some more spotlight.

 

Matteo you really don't know what you're talking about. You post walls of text with no substance to them. If you spent some time looking into KOF you'd realize why the series developed the way it did.

KOF12 is trash because it relies on very obvious frame traps, has throws that are beat clean by attacks, and rewards mashing out close C/D to start your big death combo. It's objectively stupid and players picked up on that almost immediately. You're not some kind of contrarian genius who sees something in kof12 no one else does, you're just very ignorant of what KOF's competitive appeal is.

 

Erm, I did spend the '90 playing KOF, until 97 in the arcades, after 97 the arcade I used to play closed down and I had nowhere else to go, so I just played home.

Let's, for argument sake, agree that KOF12 system was not perfect, and that it could be refined. KOF94 was refined in 95, KOF 96 was refined in 97, and then refined again in 98.

It is no 'ignorance' to lament that a fresher system was dropped for an old one without further refinement. IMO, this is unlike SNK and maybe its you who should spend more time looking at KOF.

finally, hoping that you made it this far into my post, I agree that KOF13 may be better to play competitively. but there are others players like me who wants something new as well.

 

You're the only person I've seen that has a problem with this game. Just because the system used in KOF12 was new doesn't mean it was good... in fact it was shit.

 

No, it wasnt. in fact, reviews praised its system, but complained about the lack of content. of course reviewers were not competitive gamers, but neither am I.