North UK VF thread

Re: Characters

Sorry Jerky, my mistake.

I know how much damage they do, I was saying that as Ev2 uses both Jacky and Jeff and was talking about him getting himself out of a corner. Both those moves switch position and so since he uses both chars, they are viable moves which get him away from a wall without him suffering further wall damage.

Of course there are alternatives I was just highlighting a point. It was a delibrately stupid question since, if you are the Jeff/Jacky player those moves don't cost yourself anything at all in terms of damage. (Ev2 was saying you can get out a back to wall situation but you'll sometimes receive damage...which isn't necessarily so if you know what you're doing.)


Also Shaun, if you've mastered EDTEG and TTEG then worring about Akiras "wall throw" + shouldn't be an issue since is one of his strongest directions and you should be aiming to cut it out with all your TEs.

 

Re: Characters

Chris, dude, i think you are missing my point. i wasn't saying that I myself would be at a disadvantage, i was saying that certain characters would be. as for the damage potential thing, i will say it again, i know that all characters have the POTENTIAL to get alot of damage from the wall (although Goh doesn't seem to have much.....), i am simply saying that certain characters moves are , IN GENERAL, more powerful than others(like Jeffry against someone like lion, an average Jeff combo will be like 60 damage, but an average Lion one will be more like 30-40), and in the same way, so are some peoples wall throws. (like akira, jeff, wolf etc)

as for Brads power, i was told by many people (yourself included), that Brad has the most powerful combos on the game!

also, when i said that it costs damage, i meant that, if you choose to switch positions, then you might have to choose a weaker throw, so you are loosing damage on the enemy. i also meant, that if you are deliberately trying to get out of the corner/away from the wall, then you run a risk of being caught with a failed evade, or if you repeatedly go for a throw that switches position and your opponent sees this, you are going to eat a high damage float start which will smash you into the wall.
i am not trying to say that once someone is up against the wall then they are finished, what i am saying, is that you will be at a disadvantage, (although Kage's TFT can rip the opponent in half with a wall combo) and that certain characters have better stuff to use when concidering wall combos and positioning and wall throws and all that stuff.

it seems to me that you think i am trying to say that i will be at a disadvantage, or that it will not be fair to me, personally. this is not true, although i am not too good at using the wall stuff that Jacky has (i usually go for the ++ wall throw), i use walls to full extent when i play with Jeff.

 

Re: Characters

Hmmm as for the Brad thing I've no idea where that came from. I've never said Brad has the most powerful combos in the game. In all honesty I think Akira has but I'm not 100% sure.

Thing is, when you say average combo with Lion, have you actually played with Lion? Do you know what a Lion player will do? I'd say an average Lion combo is far more than 30-40 and I'd say a Jeff one is higher than 60. Where did the numbers come from? I'll look into it and see what I find but Lion combos are certainly a lot more than 30-40.

The thing with VF is that you can't generalise anything until you know yourself. You implied Aoi/Lion etc are weak but they aren't. They may appear to you to look weak but rest assured they can be devastating.

Why would you eat a float if you're going for a throw continually? Throws are only 8 frames. As for failed evades it all adds to the mind games. How will my opponent play their way out of this? Hit or throw? etc My point was that every char has the ability to get out of a tight wall situation should it come down to it.

I'm not saying you would be at a disadvantage since you've proved time and again (here and Edinburgh) that you can beat people consistently, same with Andy. I did understand you were talking in a general sense...but the problem lies in the fact of trying to generalise things.

It's always dangerous to assume something, especially of a char you're not familar with. Until you sit down, study frame data and see what a char has to use you can't try to generalise with "he/she is weak" "he/she has weak combos" etc.

If in doubt, check things out for yourself before trying to generalise anything.

If I get the chance tomorrow I'll prove to you how weak Lion, Aoi, Jacky, Sarah etc whoever aren't.

 

Lion and Jeff, "average" combos

Ok, here we go. I tested these all vs Kage since he's the archetypal MW. This is fair since LWs can be floated higher and HWs floated less, that's the nature of the game. All damage listed is Normal Hit, then Counter Hit. c is closed, o is open stance.


LION

> + > + c 55/65
> c/o 55/60
> c/o 46/56

> + c/o 45/54

> > c/o 39/46
> 38/45
(there was a weird one I couldn't land last night but I'll try later:
> > () > > light down attack)

+ > > c 57/67
+ > + > o 54/64

+ > c/o 66/78

+ > c/o 66/80

(MC) > + > + c 77
(MC) > + > + o 82

+ > () > > + c/o 66
+ > c/o 63
+ > + c/o...60 + 25 if you opponent doesn't get up and you use a heavy down attack.


JEFF

> c/o 75/87 (I didn't include damage of possible light down attack)

> o 60/67
> c 54/61

> > o 64/79
> > > c 73/88

> > > c 69
> > o 64
(MC) > > > c 88
(MC) > > o 94

+ > c/o 53/62

+ > > c 61/76
+ > > o 63/78

+ > > c/o 79/94

+ > > c 56/68

++(MC) > c/o 62

Plus theres other stuff from threat stance like ++ hit throw and MC from +++.

So, I hope you agree that an average Lion combo does more like 50-60 (not 30-40!!!) and an average Jeff combo does more like 70 (ok, your estimate wasn't that bad for him).

As for wall stuff for Goh, since you mentioned him, I'll post back some stuff later today to show you how he can rack up damage near a wall.

Seriously though, if you think a char is outright "weak" in combos or moves, post who it is and I'll show you they aren't as weak as you'd like to think.


EDIT

Ok, for shits and giggles here's somethings Goh can do near a wall. I know you didn't bring it up but I'm going to look at Gohs back near a wall and also him attacking someone with their back to a wall:

GOH

Back to wall

Goh has 5 standard throws that could get him out of this position;

+
+
+
+
+

Now, these these could be attempted by themselves or used after stuff like or or Gohs elbow (lol his raika) for example. Goh could also try to fight his way out a corner with Tsukami or a combo whatever.

Wall combos

These were tested againts Kage again. Some rely on being a specific distance away from the wall.

+ > > (high wall hit) > > ground throw 91
+ > (high wall hit) > > + > ground throw 87
+ > > (wall hit) > ground throw 79
+ > (high wall hit) > > ground throw 83/95
+ > (high wall hit) > > ground throw 79/91

+(MC) > > > > > ground throw 89
+(MC) > > (wall hit) > > ground throw 95
+(MC) > > > + > ground throw 93

+ > > (wall hit) > ground throw 79/90

The first combo relies on the opponent not TRing from the beatdown attack (Gohs rengoku).

Admitedly these combos end with a ground throw but when you get the combo right this is guaranteed from the way the opponent falls from the wall hit/s (same way in which heavy down attacks can be guaranteed). Its a 50-50 guess as to which direction the Goh player and the opponent use for the throw (it can be done with or +) but it shows you the damage possible. In fact I did get over the 100 mark once or twice but it seemed to be with a few fluky combos.

There are loads more variations too, these are just the few I was monkeying around with. Goes to show there's more to Gohs wall combos than you may have imagined.

 

Re: Characters

right, we are really losing perspective here.

the Lion/Jeff thing proves my point; Jeff has more powerful average combos that Lion. this has been the basis of my entire arguement, some characters have more power than others. if this isn't true (as you are trying to argue), then how do you explain the fact that Akira, Jeff, Wolf are MUCH more counterable? if there moves are not any more powerful than other peoples, then surely these characters are totally useles, as there moves are more counterable and have no reward for doing this. how can you not see my point? you have proved it for me by listing a weaker characters combos (Lion) and a more powerful characters combos (Jeff). this proves my point, as it shows some people have more powerful combos than others. (the numbers i gave were just estimated, but they showed the difference that was needed)

as for Brad, i myself do not know about his power, but Andy has showed me plenty of combos that do 80+, and Ryan (Faded) has told me that Brad is very powerful.

next you mentioned gohs throws to get him out of the corner, i wasn't trying to say that he can't get himself out of the corner, what i was saying, was that he cannot use the walls in the same way that someone like Jeff or Akira can, because they have lots of moves that cause floats, and when they hit the wall they can get much more damage. Goh on the otherhand has very few floats (i can only think of one right now, but there may be a few others), and this float can only get him big damage, IF THE DISTANCE IS RIGHT AND THE GROUND THROW WORKS!

next, the 'getting away from the wall' situation. a good player is going to take advantage of the fact that their opponent is against the wall, so (assuming that the opponent too is a good player) the opponent is going to try and get away from the wall, and thus, is going to become, to some degree, predictable to the opponent. if my back is against the wall, and i am trying to reverse the situation, then i have a few options, i can go for a throw that reverses position, or i can try and evade a move. this means that my opponent will know this, and can bombard me with attacks, some of which that are half circular/full circular, so that i will be smashed out of the evade, and if i try to throw, any move will crush i. this forces me to either block untill my opponent does a move that is heavy counterable, then i can use a throw/evade to reverse, or guess when a linear move is coming. if i go with the first option, i run a risk of taking a throw, and if i go for the second option and choose to evade at thr wrong time, i take a hit, either way, i am at the disadvantage.
this shows that being next to a wall is not good, and for some characters it is worse than for others, as some character have more rewards for using the wall than others.


also, you asked.
"why would you eat a float if you are going for a throw continually?"

simple answer. float starts beat throws!

 

Re: Characters

Hang on, we're not losing perspective.

[ QUOTE ]
the thing with the Iron Fight is, it favours people with more powerful moves, as they can do more damage. plus, people with huge wall combos would have an advantage too.

[/ QUOTE ]

You started it by saying Iron Fights are unfair because of wall damage and that some chars have "higher damage moves" than others. That last part is bollocks and doesn't mean anything. On that point, higher damage combos really means nothing either. If that were so, then no one would use anyone but Akira and Jeff say. Obviously there are loads of different players who are sick with all 15 chars in evo (bar Dural lol). High damage moves/combos has nothing to do with how a fight would be "unfair".

You started your entire argument by talking about higher damage moves, when I think you were really refering to combos. The "higher damage moves" line means nothing.

Then you made a throw away comment of an average Lion combo being 30-40 and that is bollocks too as I showed.

Certainly some chars are more powerful I've never said other wise...but that's the way the game is. Some are stronger with throws, some combos, some inashis/sabakis/reversals..so what? Everything pretty much balances out.

I didn't prove you're point though, I've been saying, since I first ever started playing VF that some chars are more powerful than others. In fact I've been trying to explain to you that Jacky is sick and you STILL say he's not!

[ QUOTE ]
when i was talking about powerful characters, Jeff, Wolf, Akira, Brad . these can do more damage in general that people like Jacky, Aoi, Lion

[/ QUOTE ]

[ QUOTE ]
even Jacky, who has lots of strikes cannot take off much more damage with a wall hit, than that of a normal one.

[/ QUOTE ]

Seriously, look into Jackys combos before saying stuff like that!

Some chars are more powerful than others (to labour the point).
This is the case in any fight so why would an Iron Fight be unfair? If one char is so much more powerful than another why even play VF at all? The point is it'll balance out with other things, same things go in Iron Fights. The basic difference in Iron Fight is bigger health bars. Why should that effect the way you play VF? It shouldn't.

Read what I said about I Goh. I told you the escaping from walls had nothing to do with what you said!. As for the wall stuff note I didn't say what combos needed special positioning from a wall. It's actually very few. Same for all wall combos. Besides they can all be modified depending on how far you are away from the wall to give good results. The one you mentioned about Akira also needs special positioning. Ignoring the ground throw you're still doing nice damage...and could finish with a guaranteed light down attack.

When talking about getting away from a corner you're making huge assumptions again. Does Akira have a ful circular? No. Does he have any strings he can assault you with? No. He has or . This is just one thing to think about.

As far as "in the corner" goes, yes you're guessing games become predictable but how many players do you know you get out of jab > throw easily? That's one of the points I brought up before amongst other things. To highlight the example, Goh has 5 throw options (count em 5). Can anyone do 5 TEs? No they can't.

Talking about floats, when do they beat throws? I know you talked about trying to throw continually but let's be sensible abut this. No one is going to stand and whiff throws non stop. Being sensible with throws certainly won't mean getting floated from them all the time.


Before this topic mushrooms any further, I've not really much more to say on anything. Combos are not the be and end all of a VF player/character. I know of some top Akiras who don't worry much about combos at all, it's not in the style of their play. Like Onny said, Dai doesn't use Jeffs thows that much.

The bottom line (as I've been saying for ages) is that any char can beat any other char. The only thing that may be unfair is use of +, + type set up buttons but we've been over that to death. If you ever consider a char to be weak in some way, look round here and do plenty of reading and studying /versus/images/graemlins/smile.gif.

Peace out. /versus/images/graemlins/grin.gif

 

...

Brown Bread!!!! oh shit, Bo Selecta 3 is getting better and better. I think jack osbourne is going to be the new craig dddaaaavid. It seems like this show is getting more insane by each episode wtf is up with sharon osbourne? too good.

 

Re: ...

The Hannibal Lecktor part was fucking class. Kelly Brook in the gallery!

Craig David too...

"I'm half and half but when I'm playing netball me black side really comes out!" lol

Have you got a flask?

 

Bo

Brown Bread!

'Its good night from me and it's good night from him!'

Shaun/Chris:
Every character has their own strength's/weaknesses. As an EXAMPLE, I will pick the bones outta of my Lau:

Strength's

High Damage Juggles
Half/Mid Circular's
Great Flow Chart's
Great for ARE
Good Throws
Great Wall Damage

Weaknesses

No Sabaki's/Reversal's
Poor Striking Attack Recovery
Poor 'When Rising from Crouch' Moves
High Amount of Punch Based Striking Attacks

Lau (for me at least) is a perfect example of 'high risk>high reward' because you can't really afford to turtle with Lau (Although, it does occasionally help to punish whiffed moves with + /versus/images/graemlins/grin.gif), it's generally all about attacking for my Lau. If anyone want's to disagree, that's fine, but I find him better on the offense! Whaah!

BTW Chris: Leech Hunter ROCKS!

Will: Is everything still on for London this weekend? Meeting at Chris's at 7? Let me know, text my mobile, Chamone!

 

Stuff

Yeah Leech Hunter is proper bo when you get used to it.

As for char stregnth-weakness, I'm sick of these sort of things coming up over and over here (admitedly I've been guilty of bringing it up a few times) so any more talk of XXX is overpowered or XXX is weak, whatever, I'm just going to ignore, unless someones posted a load of crap and needs correcting.

Shaun, your Jeff is almost Champion now but I've only the first orb item atm. Next, hmmm, next I'll rank up Andys Goh and Wolf files I reckon.

 

Re: Characters

Hey Chris, I agree when you say that Iron fight doesn't favour one character more than any other since it's just a normal fight with larger health bars. As for the stuff about the walls I've gotta agree with Shaun.

[ QUOTE ]
Firstly how much damage does Jackys fbP+G or Jeffs dbP+G cost you? Both get you out from having your back in a corner. True if you're floated into a wall you're in trouble but using evade well should stop things getting to that stage.

[/ QUOTE ]

If you have any sense in these situations then you're not going to be thrown by either of these throws as they'll be high up the list of escapes. Both do get you out of being in a corner but ANY strike will beat a throw and with your back to the wall getting hit by most strikes isn't good. You say using evade well will prevent you getting hit by a strike but all it takes is for your opponent to see it coming and you'll get owned once more. Some characters ARE better at using walls than others and that can't really be in debate. You say Akira has no full circulars or strings to use, does Goh? You posted a load of wall combos for Goh but they all started with +, surely there is a "best" combo so all the others are pretty much pointless. You can't seriously tell me you'd rather be playing as Goh than Akira if you have your opponent's back to the wall.

I don't think damage potential matters all that much since Kage's combos are nowhere near as powerful as Akira's but both are strong characters (for example). But as for Brad not being high damage his floats get him huge damage so I don't know what you're on about there.

As for the whole Lion/Jeff power thing. The numbers Shaun gave were just estimated as he said. His knowledge of exact frames/damage/etc.... is awful but he was just saying that Jeff is more poweful than Lion, which you proved with your lists. Whether that is relevant in terms of the Iron fight argument is another issue.

Going back to the wall thing because I just read something else you said....

[ QUOTE ]
Talking about floats, when do they beat throws? I know you talked about trying to throw continually but let's be sensible abut this. No one is going to stand and whiff throws non stop. Being sensible with throws certainly won't mean getting floated from them all the time.

[/ QUOTE ]

Floats beat throws EVERY time. Strikes beat throws EVERY time. You say nobody is going to stand and whiff throws constantly, so what? It only takes one whiffed throw to be creamed. Equally it only takes your opponent to predict you will throw correctly and they can pick their single highest wall combo starter and drain your energy bar. True it's all just a guessing game, but if we're talking about evenly skilled players (ie me V Shaun) then whoever has their back to the wall IS at the disadvantage and any mistake will probably be punished more severely than usual. Add the fact that I've already shown you a situation where certain characters are superior to others as far as wall hits go......

As I said I don't think wall hits and combo potential make Iron fights unfair as they are just as relevant in an ordinary match. But some of the points you made weren't true.

One last thing, I've yet to see Shaun say Jacky is crap, so I don't really understand why you keep writing little paragraphs on why Jacky is so good. Jacky is ownsome and Shaun knows it.

Later.

 

Re: Characters

Hey Andy...

As for the Goh combos I was merely highlighting a point to Shaun about damage. Never once have I used many of them in a fight. Shaun brought up Akiras + > > knee/DBC combo. Now...this NEEDS certain positioning from a wall to do AND a sucessful throw. Thats juts the same as the random Goh stuff I added and Shaun tried to write them off.

[ QUOTE ]
Me: Hmmm as for the Brad thing I've no idea where that came from. I've never said Brad has the most powerful combos in the game

[/ QUOTE ]

No I didn't say Brad didn't have high damage...he has massive damage combos but I've never called him powerful myself and Shaun said I did.

The point about those throws was that you can use them to get out a corner. Thats all.

As for the wall stuff I did get sidetracked...my main point was that Iron Fight isn't really "unfair". Yeah some chars have an advantage when their opponent is near a wall...it's something you have to deal with.

As for the comments made by Shaun about Jacky check what I quoted. He put Jacky in the same "group" as Lion and Aoi. He said Jacky can only have get a few more points damage near a wall. He has mentioned other things before.

 

Re: Characters

i pretty much agree with Andy, he understands that some characters are more powerful than others. i don't know why you are suddenly saying that you think that some characters are more powerful than others, as this entire arguement has been based on me thinking that some characters are more powerful than others, and you thinking that all characters are the same power. i think the reason you think this, is the way you play the game.
when you look at power, all you do is look at a few of the highest damage combos from each character, but this does not accurately represent the character power, because some characters less powerful moves, are more powerful than other characters less powerful moves.
as for your Goh combos, as Andy said, they are all done from the same float, and there is going to be one combo that is better than all the rest, so all the others are useless. add this to the fact that all of the combos have ground throw at the end of them, it means that the opponent has a chance to escape.

and again you keep making irrelevent comments on how good Jacky is, I have never said otherwise.....


what are you talking about when you say you have never claimed that Brad is not powerful?
you said:

"since when has Brad become a high damage character? all characters have high damage potential"

this to me says that you think Brad is the same power as everyone else, thus saying that Brad is not that powerful....

MY ONLY REAL DISAGREEMENT WITH YOU IS THAT YOU SAID THAT ALL THE CHARACTER ARE THE SAME POWER, AND THAT ALL THE CHARACTERS HAVE THE SAME STRENGTHS WHEN USING WALLS.
THIS IS NOT TRUE!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

Re: Characters

*shakes head*


Quote me back when I said all chars have the same "power". You won't be able to. Thats because I never EVER said "all chars have the same power". EVER.

Read what I said.

I've always maintained that some char are more powerful than others! Never disputed the fact. BUT That has nothing to do with "powerful moves" and thats what your point was!

Quoting myself back as you obviously didn't read what said:

[ QUOTE ]
Certainly some chars are more powerful I've never said other wise...but that's the way the game is. Some are stronger with throws, some combos, some inashis/sabakis/reversals..so what? Everything pretty much balances out.

[/ QUOTE ]

Shaun you told ME I'd said to YOU, Brad was one of the most powerful in the game when I'd said no such thing! He has big combos, big deal. If he is sooo powerful why aren't more players using him?


EDIT

Quoting myself back again:

[ QUOTE ]
As for Iron Fight, it'd still be fun to decide a few games with. Anyways if you get you back to a wall or near it a good player can play themself away from the wall and out of danger. As for moves...what do you mean? No one char has "all higher damage moves" than any other.

[/ QUOTE ]

That last line is true. It does not mean all char have "equal" power as you keep saying I said (when I didn't). I was saying no-one has a complete move-list in which their moves do more damage than everyone elses.

This is what you'd said to start all this:

[ QUOTE ]
the thing with the Iron Fight is, it favours people with more powerful moves, as they can do more damage. plus, people with huge wall combos would have an advantage too

[/ QUOTE ]

Now, is this not the same for every fight that happens in a closed ring? In fact you and Andy nearly always pick closed places with high walls so there aren't any ring outs, right?

*sigh* Theres nothing more to say about it now, I think it's all been said.

 

Re: Jam on Nipples?

[ QUOTE ]
LM_Akira said:

No one char has "all higher damage moves" than any other.



[/ QUOTE ]



[/ QUOTE ]LM_Akira said:


Since when has Brad become a "high damage" char? All chars have high damage potential.



[/ QUOTE ]


[ QUOTE ]
LM_Akira said:

I still don't know what you mean about Jacky. He has huge combo potential ranging from 60 odd to 90 odd same as pretty much everyone else.



[/ QUOTE ]


all of these quote say to me that you think everyone has the same power in combos.

now, i think there might have been a misunderstanding about what i mean when i say "weak". when i say this, i mean the the "weak" character doesn't have that many high damage combos when compared to the "stronger" character. i only mean outright power when i say "weak", i am not referring to how good the character is all together.

also, i never said the Iron Fight would be unfair, i only meant that in my opinion, if we both have HUGE health bars, then surely being able to take quite a bit of it off in one go will be helpful. also, the fact that all Iron Fight matches are in high walled stages, a character with more powerful (in terms of

how much damage and how many different (because, like you said before about Goh, he has alot of different wall combos, but they are all from the same move, so this only gives him this move to work with) moves they can get the damage with, for example, Jeff has his ++, +, +, +, +, ++ (if this happens to make them hit the wall, then a knee is usually guarenteed) an i am sure he has others.

you seem to be taking all of this rather personal, when in fact we just disagree, so just chill man. by all means put your points across, but just remember that this is nothing personal, it isn't like i am calling you names (which would be really pathetic) or insulting you in any way, ok dude?


p.s. sorry about the shit graphology, i am really shit when it comes to stuff like that.

 

In Da Ruck!

Andy, this is what Shaun posted a while back (after saying Akira and Kage are too overpowered):

[ QUOTE ]
as for jacky and jeff, well we will start with jacky.
although he is fast and has a lot of combos, they are not really that difficult to deal with because most of them are two hits, and the second one is usually high, so you can just block the first hit and then crouch to avoid the second hit, then hit him during recovery. he lacks any serious power, and all of hit float combos are bloody stance specific (damn i hate that). also, his throw game is total toss. he is only hard to beat if you panic and lose your head when you are fighting him.

[/ QUOTE ]


Now, I did explain that "combos" are guaranteed. I think he thought or whatever was a combo which is why he said you can deal with them easily. That's a canned series. A combo would be + > > + or whatever.

Another point is that he does have bloody good damage from combos and they certainly AREN'T all stance specific.

His throwing game isn't "toss" either. He has 3 decent directions...note I said "decent" ok, not amazing I agree. Akiras main throwing game can be beaten out with or directions and his ST is only 40 (with guaranteed dbpm) or 60 if you manage the sick timing for guaranteed sgpm to dbpm and your opponent doesn't struggle out of it.

As far as this goes, I'd say this is Shaun saying Jacky is weak compared to others.

As for the topic, please lets change it.

 

Crossed wires

I think, overall, there's been crossed wires all over the place.

As for taking it personal, don't worry I maybe be going on and on about things but I'm not taking it as a personal attack or anything, opinions are out own and we can choose to agree to disagree about things.

The real test will be the next meet (whenever that is) as then we can see how everyone does in a few mess around Iron Fights.

As for the graphics don't worry about it.

 

Re: In Da Ruck!

ok, when i said that, my main point was that, once someone has played against Jacky for a LONG time, then his combos and mixups are not AS GOOD as when you are using them against someone with less experience.
i will never said that Jacky is weak, what i will say is that, in my opinion, Akira and Kage are better than him, because i think that Akira and Kage are in a seperate tier of their own. i don't have any PROOF, in that either of them have broken moves, i just think that moves of theirs, like Akiras super dashing elbow (14 frames? safe? 60 damage?), or kages stupid, half circular, high move evading, SAFE slap, that gets him about 50 damage. (the number could be wrong, but it is still way too much damage from a move that is that easy to land, in my opinion anyways.)


by the way, Andy might not be able to post again for a while, he just really wanted to come next door (which is where i use it coz i am friends with the neighbours) becuase he felt really strongly about what you were saying.

later guys.

 

Re: In Da Ruck!

Yeah thats fair enough, I mean I'm not going to throw my toys out the pram over a few things in a computer game.

As for everything that been said, we'll see how things go at the next meet.

 

Whoah!

WTF Has happened? Iron Fights FOR ME, ARE BALANCED, the fight's where Throw Do more damage, juggle does more damage ARE unbalanced, OK there's no wall's, but it's not like certain character's are AUTOMATICALLY SHITE when on a walled level (I.E. Kage still has wall specific combo's for TFT) and but the STRATEGY changes from level to level, but surely it's better to have the option (if at least RANDOM) of having wall's OR NOT.

BTW I MIGHT be going Australia later in the year (to see friends and will be meeting with Myke (YES THE MOD HERE AT VFDC! Chamone Motherfucker!).

I'm going home, L8er. Chris, I will enivatably text you on my journey home!