Re: Jacky/Sarah and Jeet Kune Do (open-minded only)

I am 20 (nearly 21) (re-read my post). I started when I was 4, and in the first class, in dojoryu with a buddy of mine, stoped for a while, and then went to shotokan.

It's common to get initiated early here, although the first couple of years we progress at a slow rate. In the shoto dojo I frequented, they had a class filled with kids betwen 4 and 6 (it had like 15-20 kids)

And, it's not me. You are failing in the number one reason to say I'm that guy. What reason would he have to post what I did? I probably write different too.

 

Wait, you are telling me someone would go through all this trouble to create a fake account? What kind of people frequent this forum?
If you check the dates in my webpages (in the propreties), you'll see they are like 1 or 2 years old (although that could be fooled with a calendar change, but having different dates to most files would make me changhe the calendar for each file). Moreover, if you believe those pages are up for as long as they say they are, give me a reason I'd initially come here using an email other than my CyberClaw one?

But tell me, please do, why on the heck would he ressurect a 2 year old thread under a new nickname? Any reason at all for thinking I am him, other than trying to bash the newb? Arsh comunity I'd say.

 

funny how this thread was once about Jacky and sarah and how they represent JKD, then it moved on to Bruce Lee and all that nonsense, but at least that was relevent. why is it now about how some guy may or may not be someone else as well?

why dont you all get back to talking at each other, trying in those, oh-so casual ways to show off how much you know about fighting, when none of you really care what the others are saying, y'all just trying to prove how insightful you are.
next, most of you will now insult me, saying how narrow minded i am and how i fail to understand.......blah blah blah.

BTW, i like that flashing "Cyber claw" thing you have.

 

A little less conversation, a little more action. /versus/images/graemlins/grin.gif

 

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BiakkoSoShoda said:

A little less conversation, a little more action. /versus/images/graemlins/grin.gif

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Elvis?

 

Yeah!

 

ok. i personally prefer Disturbed, but hey, Elvis is good too.

 

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EliteVersion2 said:

ok. i personally prefer Disturbed, .....

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Plates on your ass, bitch!

 

hey just stopping by to say that disturbed sucks huge asscock kthx

edit - ooooooooooohhh WA--A--A--AHHHH

 

Haha, yeah.

 

Thanks. I have this huge working banner on the forums, but I didn't trouble porting it here (because it uses HTML code together with the imgae, so that when you click on email on the banner it emails me, and when you click on the homepage part of the banner it opens my hp).

You can see it in http://boards.bigbluebox.com/ (search for a post of mine). The font is Halo's font (the XBox/PC game).

As for the initial subject, and possibly saying some big ass stupid thing, I believe Jackie and Sarah styles are somewhat similar to a "relaxed" KungFu. While JKD was different for every student, when in videogames we see a JKD practitioner, he usually follows the Bruce Lee style, which had fundations mainly on KungFu (without all the bells and whistles). To my mind other than VF, comes Dead or Alive, and Jann Lee (a clear rip off from Bruce Lee). I guess that's what most the games are aiming for when they say a character's style is JKD. They are aiming for a Bruce Lee copy (although VF seems to have some crazy aerials, like the backflips, which would left many ninja's to shame).
I dunno how similar Jackie and Sarah's moves are to Bruce Lee (I recall seeing Bruce punching with his fist sideways many times in many movies, while jackie and sarah both punch with the palm down - sometimes with rotation - similar to a shoto punch, but without the almost useless elbow backing).

Anyway, that's my guess. They build up on Bruce Lee's style, and get specific moves from everywhere to complement and balance the characters. For one, most of Sarah's grabs are very "Wrestling" like (except the kick to the face one). Personally I like Sarah's balance and general feel, but the moves look and style should be less diversified IMO (I find the grabs out of place for e.g.).

 

For everybody:

PLEASE DON'T INSULT MARTIAL ARTS (ESPECIALLY CHINESE) ANYMORE.

THank you. /versus/images/graemlins/grin.gif

 

i wasn't arguing/agreeing with you, i have not got any clue about martial arts, i was just saying that you all need to stop talking AT each other, trying as hard as you can to convey all your knowledge as views on the subject, without actually listening to each other. you are all convinced that you know everything there is to know about combat, and think that your opinions are absolute, and that everyone else should agree with you.
you have to accept, that as long as you will voice your opinions, someone else will disagree.
like i said, i have no clue about all this JKD nonsense, i picked Jacky on recommendation. i do like his moves and the way they look, but i guess i fall into the catagory of "one of those guys who like him because he does flashy moves". i don't think that anyone on any fighting game accurately portray their style properly, because the characters dont actually feel pain, so there is never any element of fear or realism, for example, there is no way that Aoi or Shun would be able to beat Jeffry or Wolf, because of the simple fact that there is such a huge size difference. you can talk all you want about technique and style blah blah blah, but when someone is three times your body mass, you will not be able to win in a real fight because nothing will work.

 

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I dunno how similar Jackie and Sarah's moves are to Bruce Lee (I recall seeing Bruce punching with his fist sideways many times in many movies, while jackie and sarah both punch with the palm down - sometimes with rotation - similar to a shoto punch, but without the almost useless elbow backing).

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Well, you have some Jacky mvts like + in "Death Game 2" (if you saw the movie, you will remember imediatly, it's done 2 times and also the bad guy does the exaxt same move as counter!)

Gorbag

 

Sorry, EliteVersion, you're wrong there. While mediocre technique < great size, great technique > great size. You're probably basing your views on things like UFC, backstreet brawls, gang fights and other things like that. If a fairly unskilled person were to rush me in a 'serious' situation, depending on how they do it, they'd get an elbow at the base of the skull, a forearm strike to the temple, a simultaneous knee to the groin and forearm to the throat, two thumbs to the eyes, or a knifehand to the larynx. All of those end the fight, potentially permanently. Maybe I'd step back and ride their face into the ground, or execute one of various wraparound or stepaside throws, or just pull them down on top of me with both knees poised under their stomach so they land on them. If they reach out off balance to grab me, there are various 'drawing out' throws designed to take advantage of that. If they reach out to grab me while on balance (which doesn't take full advantage of their size), then there are various joint locks to be applied, they can leave themselves open to a strike while they grab, and I can always move away. If they swing at me, I back away. None of those require me to be larger than my opponent or stronger. Nearly everyone's joints lock the same way. If your elbow or wrist are locked, you're screwed, no matter how big and how strong you are, because you either go with what they're doing or you end up with a dislocation or a break, and it doesn't take much strength at all to perform certain locks (the lowly thumb lock is a great example). Eyes and throat don't need much strength to damage, either.

 

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A little less conversation, a little more action.
/versus/images/graemlins/grin.gif


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you're all very theorical guys...
There's sometthin' behind tech, phisics, circular kicks
sandbag, sparring or competition...
Catch it?
It's all right until we play VF.
Excuse, maybe I'm not "open minded" enough to talk 'bout this.
Enjoy. /versus/images/graemlins/grin.gif

 

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EliteVersion2 said:

I don't think that anyone on any fighting game accurately portray their style properly, because the characters dont actually feel pain, so there is never any element of fear or realism.

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I've never heard that explanation, but I like it. Makes sense to me.

Shaolin_Hopper: I accept your story as long as you're fighting someone that's slow and lacking skills. Even so, one bad mistake and you're toast. EliteVersion2's description of Aoi vs. Wolf involves two skilled fighters with vast differences in size and mass. In that case I think massive+skills > not-so-massive+skills.

 

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Nashi said:

Hey my friends...
UFC?......*sigh*
Go see some Vale Tudo in Brasil (it's written with an S, english is so stupid that they use a Z instead of S, =P). Anyways...nothing beats out Shaolin Kung Fu, and you guys should know that better than anyone. I did Ju Jitsu (japanese jj) and it worked out to be the most shitty martial art i've ever seen. See...it's like this...You get the techniques, but u don't get the philosophy part. U don't get the breathing part. You don't get the "close your eyes and hit the freaking fly with ur tongue" part. Don't u understand?? Get kazaa, and download a shaolin kung-fu demonstration video. Then check out those guys falling, no pain man...they fall like dolls, but still: NO FUCKING PAIN. You don't learn how to nullify pain in Ju jitsu do you? Nor in any other martial art throughout the world, except in japan and china (and maybe India).

Please guys, I hope I won't have to repeat myself...

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How does one respond to such retardation? You know nothing about martial arts so keep your mouth shut.
Anyways as far as the best representation goes for JKD is Jacky by far. If anyone in here has actually trained in JKD or bought any of Bruce Lee's fighting method books you will see actual JKD moves in Jacky's repertoire. I have even received instruction from Jerry Poteet (sp?), he is one of the few that carries on the original teachings Bruce Lee left behind without adding in stuff. I can go on and analyze Jacky's move list and point what is and is not JKD but there is no point. As far as fighting games go Jacky has the most authentic JKD moves. It's not like Vanessa, who is supposed to be Vale Tudo fighter but fights nearly noting like one.

 

i see you're point. i guess i have never really seen a "skilled" person fight an "unskilled" person, they have always been both skilled (fighting arenas and what not) or unskilled (bar room brawls). i am not a big guy, i am six foot one and i weigh less than nine stone(about 100 pounds i think). i feel that, even if i was some fighting machine, that a 6 foot 8, 18 stone (250 pounds, or something like that) guy, who has no fighting experience would still kill me. i used to do Karate (for six months in an amateurs class) and my sensei was tiny, he could do all the right moves, but he didn't look like much of a threat to your average rugby player. but this is just my toughts, and as i know little about fighting, i guess they are pretty uneducated, so i guess i wil have to listen to you guys on this.
none of this was really my point though, i just thought i would tell you anyways.
what i was getting at, was the fact that VF characters do not (in my opinion) convey a real fighting style. no beat em up does, coz the fighters don't feel pain. if you punch someone twenty times (or once if your good at it) in the arm, it won't work, but the character still use it perfectly. and even in those games where limbs ARE disabled, it simply prevents you from using that move, it doesn't actually simulate pain. if your arm has been broken in two are three places, then there is little chance that you would be able to continue the fight simply not using that move; the pain would be too great for almost everyone. i guess this is just something that video games will never be able to conquer unless they issue every copy of VF with a virtual reality simulator, that creates a sense of pain, fear and urgency. but even then, in the mind it would not be real, and if such a thing WERE possible, then it would just be down to who could ACTUALLY fight the best, so i think it is a permenent flaw that cannot be overcome. views, anyone?

 

The problem with a 'simulator' such as you describe is that of balancing issues. The vast majority of the throws you see in most fighting games are crippling or lethal. Goh's ground throw where he rolls and falls to the outside of your knee, as an example, would be devastating. Aoi's ground throws all involve dislocation or destruction of the joints. You'd have to balance this out against just how devastating each character's striking attacks would be. And by the time you were done, you'd have fights ending on the first engagement, which is pretty much what would happen against top end people in an all out no holds barred event.

Plague: Once you get past a certain skill point, size doesn't really help you much, since you're both lethal. Speed is where the real advantage lies - who can deliver first. It would be who landed a grapple first - does Wolf manage to grab Aoi, or does she manage to grab his wrist as he's reaching for her? Her technique doesn't require her to have massive size - aikido is joint manipulation, not leveraging like judo is, and even strong people have to bow when they're the victim of a joint lock, or suffer severe damage. Wrist locks require very little strength to apply, as an example.