SF4 Impressions (after actually playing)

I thought you could deal with that stuff by focus cancelling into backdash on wakeup.

 

I'll assume you're familiar with most ST terminology for what I'm writing.

Super Turbo is the most balanced, difficult, deep, and hardcore game in the Street Fighter series, by far. Inputs are extremely demanding (1/60 for a reversal is basically akin to Akira's knee), many match ups have brutally fast paces, and one hit can mean the difference between winning and losing. There are so many instances in ST that are forced nitaku and they allow for excellent mind games. It's not as complex as VF but ST is the pinnacle of 2D fighting.

Sirlin specifically said that he wanted HD Remix to be beginner friendly. Meaning tons of stuff was changed so the game would appeal to scrubs. Some examples taken from Sirlin's blog:

• Dragon punch timing is easier
• 360s throws have alternate easier motions
• Tiger knee motions have been removed and made easier
• Mash moves are easier and take less button presses
• All 3-button moves changed to 2-buttons

The problem is that making moves easier to do, changes the balance and mechanics dramatically. Hawk and Zangief could not do their SUPERS from standing and if you tried a walk up and command throw you had only 3 or 5 frames respectively to get it or you would jump instead.

Changing the commands for special throws in ST would be like if Sega decided changing Wolf's GS or KS to QCF+P+G or even F,F+P+G because scrubs complained about how 'hard' the motion was.

With this philosophy Sega should make the DLC or SPOD very simple. DLC should just be F+K+G,P,F+P+K so scrubs can get it every time. The KNEE should be hold G for 10 frames or less and not just 1 single frame.

And changing PPP and KKK moves to PP and KK means that you cannot reversal with two buttons for some moves (like Balrog's headbutt) because you might accidentally get a TAP instead which was a change Sirlin didn't even realize. "This is specifically to make the moves easier to execute on a gamepad (as opposed to an arcade joystick)". Because people can't map PPP and KKK to one button? They could in every SF game on console I've played.....except for HDR. /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/sleep.gif

Imagine if Sega made the console ports of VF so that the character moves were changed so that people could play easier on a pad. VFDC would implode. Want to do the knee after Koenraku? Just press F+K, no need to buffer a crouching dash for a FC move from the end of the throw animation just mash F+K.

Many people hate HDR because it was made for scrubs primarily. And for people who play classic mode they find that it is terrible online compared to vanilla ST on GGPO. And Remix Mode balance changes are cause of more debate than agreement. Not to mention the game has more bugs and glitches in it than anything I've ever player in my life.

And half of the things that Sirlin wanted to implement like replays, or pause disable mode for tournaments, or hitbox pausing during training, he ran out of time for. This was a major complaint about VF5 on the PS3, that half of the things we expected (good A.I., training modes like EVO) were not there.

Super Turbo is dated game play? /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/confused.gif LOL!

 

This is basically akin to saying "stop reading now".

 

Nice e-drunk

 

-I bought it in hopes of something new and fresh. (fail)
-I played it for two days straight and nothing came from it. (fail)
-I sat down and investigated the new system and found nothing interesting. (fail)
I really hate it! I really do!

End of line..

MY REASON FOR NOT LIKING THE GAME IS THAT IT'S 100% BORING. Is that good enough now? Having said that, I will play hd if anyone is up for some in the future. Oh yes, my videogame credentials date back to RENTING atari games from a local book store. AM I TOO LEGIT TOO QUIT NOW???

 

Thinking jumping should be safe in SF is like, saying you should be able to evade full circulars in VF lol.

I understand if people don't like it. That's fine. But I don't understand the constant criticism that it's like older SFs (Actual Street Fighters, you know, alphas, CvS2, etc. Not 3S lol). It would be like me saying VF5 isn't different enough from 4. It's just a facelift. No point in playing it, it's a garbage game cause it didn't do anything innovative/fresh/exciting.

And talking about these fighters like they're just trends? SC4, at EVO, gonna have like, 4-5 times as many as VF could pull. SF4, at EVO, likely for the next decade lol. With numbers I can't even predict. I'm not of the belief that if something is popular that it's better. That's not what I'm trying to say here. But to call it a 'flavor of the month' or trendy game? C'mon now.

That's like saying, I don't like Nitaku situations. But I've come to accept it. Defense in SF requires a lot of pattern recognition, reaction and ability to execute. I have a lot of respect to those who have great defense in SF, and other 2D games.

I think after reading this thread, it's just best VF sites speak about VF. And SF sites speak about SF.

 

Well just because a few people have their opinions it doesn't mean the entire site should be pigeonholed. Also, i've been playing street fighter since 91 and played almost every day from 91-94 with the top US players at the time. I played in tournaments at worlds finest comics every weekend, played in the national tourneys as well as japans 2nd national tourney for champion edition so I think I have enough credentials to express my opinion about sf games and not sound like a fool. Besides, the point of this thread is so people could share there opinions and I dont think EVERY post has been negative. Actually, most have been the opposite. There are things I don't like about the game but thats FOR ME! I'm not telling anyone not to play it. Like I said in a previous thread, if you like it, enjoy. I just wanted to hear other peoples opinions about the game.

 

It's not the negativity and people disliking it which bothers me. It's the so called reasons some have stated. I wasn't getting at you for making the thread either. I was happy to see it posted. Just ehhh at how it's turned out.

 

I understand

 

The biggest issue I think is that with the game being out, people aren't playing VF. It stings, especially to those that feel a game ain't as good as VF is.

I'll just say now that I found some new knowledge about some things, I'm enjoying the game for what it's worth a whole lot more than I did, even from earlier today.

 

Seems like me and you have the same years of experience in SF2 series lol!! I respect your opinions cause you have knowledge on Sf2.some dudes first video games were VF4 Evo so they can't see or understand why people feel a way about SF4. The Combo system is not rewarding or deep at all and that what suck most of all. Ex moves are not as strong as you think.
You get one superbar that takes long as hell to fill up just for the same freaking super move.Its not like you choose a Super art and you still get a Ultra for variation. In other words compared to other streetfighter games once the director say he wanted to take it back tot he essense of SF2. SF2 heads knew this was a cover up for "Dumbing it down" for the casual gamer.


A little Story i wanted to share with you guys.

I remember i mentioned something about SSTF2HD to L.A. Akira in a post and he took me to challenge just to show me how cheap Chun Li prorities were in a tournament level. Not knowing this guy has the same amount of experience as me He choose Chun Li to prove his point and i used Guile to prove mine (Using a Xbox pad mine you.). We came to a stalemate until someone jumped in.We were supposed to record our battles to show people on this site. L.A. never save it the little battles we had(Shame on you L.A. lol). The one thing i remember L.A. saying is "After a While you know what to do to get out." because Chun Li's pressure games was tight. It tooks Skills and dedication to keep Chun Li off your ass if she was being used by a very good player. Now in SF4 rising Dragon punches/anti-airs and supers are way to easier to pull off.


Ex Moves is the reason why most of whateva you learn in this Era or version of Streetfighter does not apply.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d0cFs5mHQC4

 

A lot of people said that, hell they said the same about vf3->VF4..

I will hopefully getting my copy today. While I dont really like bashing other games too much, I doubt I will enjoy SF4 because of the different playstyle.

ps. I wish people would say "I dont like this" instead of "this game sucks". The former is a personal opinion, the latter can be read that theres something wrong with the game.

 

Hey guys what's going on in here? /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/laugh.gif

I've actually sunk the equivalent of the gross income of a small country into SF4 arcades, so yeah, I like that game a lot.

When I first saw the videos, I thought "no way, Capcom's kidding, no way I'm playing this - and they stole El Blaze". However, when I actually gave it a spin, I was hooked. It looks beautiful, sure, but what I liked the most was the feeling of "smoothness" the game has. It felt dynamic while at the same time elegant, and it had Abel - eat seoi nage, hadou-sucker! Fun times /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/grin.gif .

However, there's more to that -

SF2 was the *first* computer game I ever played, on my neighbour's Amiga computer (bless its soul), when I was like 8 years old. I knew who Guile and Blanka was basically all my life - and now, thanks to the new game being a *good* fighter actually, I find it sort of endearing that that knowledge won't die, heh. Go go green electric jungle monster!

To those of you that are complaining that inputs are not hard enough... Well... Sorry, but I cannot sympathize... I'm all for tactics and yomi to win the fight, and not losing because "the move didn't work out". Are you seriously complaining people have more control over their characters now?

Not a new game? It has six new characters, two new system features and for the first time in history - new costumes. AND it's Street Fighter. A small revamp of moves wouldn't hurt, but for now, if I have a chance to enjoy it without constantly feeding the machine and the cigarette chokehold - I'm hooked.

Griev, you hear me? I'm coming for you!!! /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smirk.gif

 

Even if we say it sucks, it's still just an opinion.

No need to stick imo at the end of every entence or anything like that.

 

if people are saying the inputs aren't hard enough they're not going through C. Viper's Hard Trail Mode . . . seriously that shit is hard. Old SF vets have a hard time using her.

SF's input difficulty doesn't come from the same vein as VF's which I think is where the confusion is.

 

C.Viper is nothing. IF anybody did sya the inputs are hard they never played streetfightrer period.

@jigohro - you were 8 hen SF2 dropped? i was 10 when 2 dropped and was by time was 12 i waw a terror (Atleast in playland and various arcades in brooklyn.)

You will never understand why some people have dislike for this game. Its not Bashing its called having a opinion period.If you paid for the CD then you can say whateva you like.This is what i do to see if you even worthy of me to explain to you my dislike. I'll play you in a few game and depending on what you do i respect your opinion or not honestly. I know how i get down in 2-D games.

 

What's your point SDS ?
That old school gamers cannot appreciate SF4 cause it's a noob game ?

 

We are all noobs compared to SDS. I've been playing street fighter on and off for the past maybe 17 years and enjoy SF4. Its what got me into the arcade scene. I say just enjoy the game, and have fun with it. Who knows when we'll see another SF game.

 

You know I recognize your experience. But prove that it;s nothing, post a video of you doing a couple reps of her hard mode combos without inconsistencies.

That stuff is genuinely tough.

 

@SDS, we played yesterday and yes, you are very good for just starting. But even I know enough about the game to see you could have pushed it much further! You weren't EX canceling to extend combos and you were using Ken and Ryu (uhhh, that's why the game feels stale to you, Ryu has been stale since... forever!).

I'm sitting there trying to use El Fuerte, and you kicked my ass, but you could've used a character other than an old-school Shoto. Your Abel was pretty good when you switched though and I was happy to see you had learned him.

However, I've done some of Abel's Challenge Mode and there's a point where the combos become EXTREMELY hard and VERY technical; I don't believe you have finished Hard Challenge mode yet. I just don't.

Every character's Combo Challenge Mode has some <u>ridiculously hard combos to pull off.</u> Until you have really gone trough that to see what is possible and what isn't, your still new to the game.

I find the game to be so fun I don't want to stop playing. It seems very deep to me, contrary to your opinion... This game has so much to it, I think it's more technical that SF3 deep down. The pace of the game has made Yomi more important.

I know you think the inputs are too easy but I couldn't disagree more. What SF game has ever even given you the option to EX cancel mid-combo, then dash cancel that and go for another insane 2-in-1... Instead of complaining, become a master at SFIV and force people to see your point...

When you are able to smash everyone I'll believe you that the game is too easy. When I see you using a lot "links" into supers and stuff, I'll be convinced. The "Linking" system has timing down to 1 frame[/size] very often.

<span style='font-size: 17pt'>PART II</span>

This is some SDS-BS! I'm hurt by this actually...

I was in the arcade playing VF1 with printed out move-lists from the computer! I'm 28 and have been playing fighting games my whole life. From "Tongue of the Fat Man" to "Budokan" to "SFIV" I've been there.

Maybe I see the world differently than you and choose to focus on the big picture rather than get worked up over small details. SFIV as a total, stand alone game, is awesome. It's a great game. You may just be a gamer that obsesses over details instead of playing the game for what it is...

I feel bad for you that you defend your opinion by insulting my knowledge base, but you don't know anything more about gaming than me.