Soul Calibur V announced

Meh. They can take my money anyday

*Love you Ezio* I have the AC2 theme song on my iPod. Also planning on making some sweet love to the music aswell.
Too much.

 

Because people wanna feel like they're doing something without having to put so much effort in winning. The degredation in skill level has ran through every genre of game. Think of how games like Unreal Tournament, or Mass Effect get dumbed down heavily for the sake of "getting more sales"...

Namco has been doing that since the first SC... Let's just eliminate the whole weapon destruction system, and put more emphasis on ring outs... You could people out easily in that game. Not to mention they put more emphasis on combos, since people who played Soul Edge eventually started going for weapons that launched the highest, and/or gave a speed boost so combos could be done (i.e.- Mitsurugi + Falx + combos = GGs)... While the game did go through an evolutionary change for the better in SC and the others that followed, in some ways that exact change became something that dumbed the game down somewhat...

My real beef with the game is that its not as consistent as it used to be in terms of the actual system itself... I mean from SC1-3AE I felt like they were tweaking it to make it better, but with 4 its like they scraped everything and tried something totally different. Then they're doing the same thing with 5, and I'm like stick with what works.

Sure, I don't mind some changes like VF3's 4 button setup, or Tekken's shorter window to chicken a reversal, or even their introduction to walls. I just feel that SC's recent changes have been moreso dreastic than revolutionary... It doesn't even give off the "Soul Calibur" vibe. I felt like I was watching Plasma Sword/Star Gladiator 2 with better sidesteps.

Granted, Jaxelrod gave it a thumbs up, and supposedly he hates everything and only like SC2, but even still, I'm still skeptical of this game...

Screw having guest characters though. They should've just worked on some of the characters they introduced in SC3, like the 3 sisters, Revenant, "SC3" Arthur (I know he's not "new" technically). I wouldn't mind if they brought back Necrid and tweaked him so he was actually balanced. Same with Algol...

 

I would rather play a game with poor production values and lots of attention to system that a game with lots of flash thats unbalanced to hell. Maybe I'm just one of the "old" gamers that needs to move on and let the new breed take the place?

Thing is I hate this new approach to making games it seems like company's want a game that will sell millions and be as empty as an ignorant mind, rather than selling lets say 1 million and being chock full of value.

 

The only thing I'm skeptical of atm is the 1frame punishers with their supers. Outside of that most of it looks rather proper.

 

I understand you... But you know what, people will take the empty game if the netcode was somewhat above subpar, but bash the mess outta the one game that's actually solid, but doesn't have a great netcode... My biggest example is Battle Fantasia... Solid, 3S-like gameplay with a dash of Guilty Gear, but the netcode isn't too hot. To make matters worse, the console version was a rebalanced version so even more care was given to the game, because the arcade version had tons of issues. Even after all of this, its still not "EVO-bigscreen-worthy"...

I don't necessarily mind making something a bit accessible for newer players (i.e.- easier character to learn, etc), but dumbing the whole game down is ridiculous...

Believe it or not, 3S did have some things that seemed to be moreso for newer players. Target combos for instance, are way easier to do, and some benefit even more by being able to cancel into specials or supers. This was never in any other SF game before that. It didn't dumb the game down to any extent, because the players are still required to learn more about the game to become a stronger player.

Anyway, companies are only doing this because they see how it greatly increases sales. It's not about the love of the genre, or the art/passion anymore... COD, WoW, GOW, ME2, and even MUA2 are prime examples of successful "flashy piñatas" that don't have any depth inside. It's like trading a full balanced meal for a happy meal with theme music...

 

I don't know why some people get upset the moment a producer says "we are making the game more accessible". Does accessible have to mean dumping down the game system or does it mean giving a tool for new comers to compete or even making the execution of moves easier to do?

Cause even if it does I don't see any issue. All that I see is the rant of some elitists who can't get off unless it's some type of a hard crazy combo to pull. Till when are you gonna continue this fruitless ranting?

Can't a fighting game be about Yomi instead of hard core anal execution? Or are you afraid of some newbe coming and wiping your ass just because he read all of your moves?

Not everyone have the time to sit for hours trying to get the last 13+ hit combo and then practicing it over and over again tell he/she can do it while a sleep.


To me SC is 2nd to VF. Because just like VF, SC relies on Yomi more than execution. Granted, there are some hard combos to pull in VF, but I never needed more than an hour to pull them off (and this is coming from a person who plays Akira as a main). And I never relied on hard combos to win in VF or SC. All I relied on is the games system itself.


Anyways, I did get to try SCv at TGS and so far I liked it. The movements were very responsive and felt very sharp. Side Stepping felt like VFs SS. Ukemi is waaaaayy better than SC4. And pulling off a Just Defend is not as easy as it looks. I liked the meter idea cause it makes you think how are you going to manage it to your own style of play. Would you save it to do Critical Edge combos and take damage from your opponent? Or use it extensively for Guard Impacts?

My only beef with the game right now is graphics and animation. They didn't change a thing (graphic engine wise). They just remodeled the characters and refined their animations. Nothing of a big deal. Also the characters in the built I played were lacking lots of moves. Hopefully we'll get the whole set and more when the game come out.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=o0JHsnjEs4Y

 

I'm all for yomi, and I'm all for making something accessible, and I'm a combo fiend, so I could care less about whether they're easier/harder to do. Not trying to sound like salty MvC2 vets, but my beef is when those changes that make things accessible take away from the game overall--

For example, DOA's counter system could be great, but accessibility shouldn't mean you can mash out b+F and counter all day... That game in itself is probably the most accessible fighting game imo, and Team Ninja while they've done good for the casual by changing it from a 4-point to a 3-point parry system. I feel like they made it stupid easier to parry, to the point in which they diminished the true aspect of yomi, which the game is heavily built on. On top of that, adding moving danger zones don't serve a purpose, whether they're aiming for the hardcore or casual player. I've witness both casual and hardcore players alike complain about that stupid raptor running around messing up their game...

The thing with fighting systems is that if you want to make something easier for newcomers, it still has to provide some sort of challenge to those more skilled at the game...

It's like Trix cereal... I grew up when Trix cereal was little colored balls, now they've got actual fruit shapes to make it more appealing. The shit still needs to taste the same, else they've lost a customer ya know???

Anyway, I'll use the combo system in Tekken to show this here "balance". Back in Tekken 1/Tekken 2, I could kill you with Kazuya in like 2 combos. Fast forward to Tekken 6, I'd still be able to do the same. Sure, the combos have been made easier to do, and they added new features to it, but real talk, Tekken was never primarily about combos to begin with. That's just the one thing that everyone sees so they make assumptions + it's the flashy appeal, because no other popular 3D fighter was doing it (VF, though it had combos, its just not the same). It was one thing that was noticed upon giving the game to the players (because 3D fighters then were floaty, and this helped them in the combo department) and it eventually became an integral part of the game once it was adpoted and it was catered to, especially in Tekken 3. It's heavily based on pokes, and learning to switch up on offense and defense. They had things in there that made it casual friendly like 10-hit strings and such, but even the hardcore adopted that into their strats, as some characters had good juggles using a portion of their 10-hit string, and parts of some made good poke/mixup strings.

Well, from what I see with SC5, it looks way better than SC4. At the same time though, I'm still skeptical though. SC3 added the just frame parries, and that was hell, because the character that successfully j/f parried could still get hit with A,A or B,B by many characters, and in some cases specific moves could be done. I do wish it were more consistent with the game engine though, but that's just my preference...

 

Unfortunately, there've been many instances where making a game "more accessible" made it less fun for everybody, new players included.

Smash Brothers Brawl. No one likes tripping. Not beginners, not pros. In fact it punishes beginners more than it does pros.

Tribes. They added a whole bunch of "fun" things to Tribes Vengeance which totally messed up the balance, effectively making certain character classes obsolete. Hardcore players also complained that the skiing mechanic was implemented really badly. Skiing was one of the best things about Tribes, but also the main reason good players were stomping over the new players, so they changed it, to make it more "accessible" and took out the fun from the game. Worst of all, to non-Tribes players, it was still the same mediocre game. The only ones who noticed the difference were the people who actually supported the franchise.

I'm not against making games more fun for beginners. I object when they sacrifice core game elements that make the game fun in the first place.

Besides, it's not like the casuals ever notice when system changes are made.

SC4 system changes to make it more accessible? Guess what? The only people who noticed them were the people who were already SC players.

Tekken system changes? I've had so many people tell me Tekken 6 is the exact same game as Tekken 4 and Tekken 2 and Tekken Tag... Remember Tekken 4 when they changed the game to make it more accessible? The casuals took one look and said "Meh, it's still same old Tekken."

VF5FS changes? Bet no one outside the VF community notices or gives a crap.

Why pander to people who don't know any better?


My apologies for going a bit off topic.

Back to SCV,

It's.... Dampierre!!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o0JHsnjEs4Y

Reminding me of Robbie Rotten from Lazytown though...

 

Well, it's all opinions, but while I hate dumbing games down as much as the next guy (not talking about reducing clutter, but stuff like exchanging mix-ups for just frames, reducing player's freedom and choosing flash over substance)... I'm willing to defend ME2 to death. Combat in ME1 was bland (as in "lacking tactical options", not non-flashy) and generally same-y from 1st level to the last. ME2 offers a way different experience based on the class choice, weapon choice or even simple spec, allowing the use of terrain, flanking and squadmates use. It was *not* dumbed down, it was enriched. Shuffling with the inventory was fun until a certain level, then it was just tungsten cd-reducing spectre gear all the way and a metric bucketton of vendor gear (playing on insanity I've reached the cash cap like 3 times with nothing to spend on...). It was an illusion of choice, not a choice - a ton of options at the first glance, but precious few viable. ME2 gave visually less choices, but they matter. There's like 4 entirely different ways to build and play the infiltrator class alone, and then some permutations.

Not to mention that for a rather poor story (a common trait of "middle parts", sadly) - the presentation and immersion were spot-on, which is pretty much the main thing about RPG's really - looting corpses and leveling don't matter if the game doesn't make you give a damn about story. ME2 had a mediocre story, but had the "giving a damn" part spot-on.

/endrant, back to SCV

Ooooh. Now that's a character I can relate to. Maybe there is hope, if only there are more than 4 usable moves per character as Namco likes to do .

...actually, just give me Cassandra, we've already seen that they don't give a damn about this "age" thing (Tira and Hilde look exactly the same, funny but not that I complain... timeskips are dumb anyway, for the most part).

 

I agree to an extent and can see the same sort of thing happening with VF5FS. It depends on how hard a particular fighter is on the beginner level (basic fundamentals, beginner combos etc) that decides how much of a difference making it accessible would make to a new audience. With SC movement and basic combos were always very easy, the ground tech system is simple and there were few difficult moves to worry about so beginners see no difference in SC4. VF4 to VF5 is different matter I feel as VF4's movement system was so hard it put a lot of beginners off and a lot of moves were throw unsafe forcing you to learn MTE.

I think it's more important to make a game more visually appealing and make the first time playing a game feel fun in some way to a beginner. Having a great set of game modes and tutorial/challenge too. That's the sort of thing that can draw them in and keep them.

 

I don't like Dampierre. He looks like he's trying too hard to be funny.

 

Here's the character creation trailer -

http://www.gametrailers.com/video/character-creation-soul-calibur/723520

 

Soulcalibur's Edge Master and SCIV's Algol return.

Also 2 new modes announced:
-Quick Match
-Boss rush-type mode

 

The customization looks amazing this time cant wait to create some chars!!

 

Pretty interesting article and interviews with the development team in the latest issue of Games TM.

Basically they consider this game to be Soul Edge 2, they even wanted to name it that but were stopped by a trademark conflict. Some other interesting stuff in there too, i'll take a read through it and post the more interesting stuff later.

 

I thought the same but that's what the director of SCV said :s

 

Actually looking forward to this game, by the way, do any of u guys think Ivy is a little similar to Tekken's Nina Williams? They share at least one or two moves, both somewhat cold-blooded; heartless women and now with Ivy's reason for being included in Soul Calibur 5 since the 17 year jump from SC4, where she didn't age like Nina did not as well when frozen? Your thoughts?

Plus the character creation and customization is sooo amazing, will really keep us glued to the game much more than SC4.