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VF5 Ver.C Goh Command List

Discussion in 'Goh' started by Myke, Dec 16, 2007.

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  1. Leonard_McCoy

    Leonard_McCoy Well-Known Member

    I think Goh's Kumiteharai P+K is incorrectly classified in the command list. It is no sabaki but an inashi. Sabakis are <u>attacks</u> (see Goh's 3P+K) that hit and damage the opponent even if the parry didn't connect. Inashis don't do that because they are simply <u>moves</u> with deflection properties if they connect, or a whiff animation (at best) if they don't.

    Now, Goh's Kumiteharai P+K move doesn't hit the opponent in any way.
     
    Leonard_McCoy, Mar 8, 2009
    #21
  2. Myke

    Myke Administrator Staff Member Content Manager Kage

    PSN:
    Myke623
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    Myke623
    From: http://virtuafighter.com/wiki/doku.php?id=vf5:system_part_2#sabaki

    <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">A Sabaki is a regular attack or motion with attack-deflection properties.

    ...

    Sabaki can be further classified as two types:

    1. Sabaki-attack: as the name suggests, is a regular attack with attack-deflection properties. On its own it can be used just like any other attack.
    2. Sabaki-reversal: are motions which will reverse an opponents attack, usually with no damage.
    Some Sabaki-reversals, when successful, allow for a continuation attack. An example is Goh's /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif+/forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif ...
    </div></div>
     
    Myke, Mar 8, 2009
    #22
  3. Leonard_McCoy

    Leonard_McCoy Well-Known Member

    Hm.
     
    Leonard_McCoy, Mar 9, 2009
    #23
  4. SUGATA

    SUGATA Well-Known Member

    PSN:
    SUGATA_RUS
    Ok, what is Inashi then (What difference between Kumite-harai as Sabaki and Aoi's 4P+K+G as Inashi? -I don't get it, and fully agree with Leonard)?
     
    SUGATA, Mar 9, 2009
    #24
  5. Myke

    Myke Administrator Staff Member Content Manager Kage

    PSN:
    Myke623
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    Myke623
    The main difference is that the sabaki always completes its motion the same way, in full, regardless of the success/failure. The inashi only completes its motion when it is successful.
     
    Myke, Mar 9, 2009
    #25
  6. Leonard_McCoy

    Leonard_McCoy Well-Known Member

    Thanks, Myke, for taking the time to elaborate more on that. I think the description in the glossary (that I was referring to) is a bit misleading for it's a bit imprecise. Your clarification, though, was completely enlightening.
     
    Leonard_McCoy, Mar 9, 2009
    #26
  7. jonasg33k

    jonasg33k Active Member

    so /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/df.gif /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif + /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif is not a sabaki but an inashi ?
     
    jonasg33k, Mar 9, 2009
    #27
  8. Leonard_McCoy

    Leonard_McCoy Well-Known Member

    LOL - a classic.

    Nope, 3P+K is a sabaki. It even animates (and hits) if the sabaki doesn't connect to a parry.
     
    Leonard_McCoy, Mar 9, 2009
    #28
  9. Myke

    Myke Administrator Staff Member Content Manager Kage

    PSN:
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    You're welcome. I'll revisit the Glossary definitions soon in the hopes of making their differences a little more clearer.
     
    Myke, Mar 9, 2009
    #29
  10. Manjimaru

    Manjimaru Grumpy old man

    PSN:
    manjimaruFI
    XBL:
    freedfrmtheReal
    Ive not heard the term "inashi" used in a long time...
     
    Manjimaru, Mar 10, 2009
    #30
  11. Combolammas

    Combolammas Sheep

    - /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/df.gif /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif crouch stagger
    - /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif crouch stagger

    - /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/df.gif /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/df.gif /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif slam / flop on hit and counter

    - Wallbreak mentioned in /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif; /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/f.gif /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif; /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/f.gif /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif + /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif, /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif

    - Also old "slam on recovery counter hit" on /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/b.gif /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/f.gif /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif although it slams on any hit anyway

    - /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/db.gif /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif Old "Low throw guaranteed on MC" text. Not sure if this is really necessary or in union (or something) with the other datas since there's usually no mention of guaranteed throw on +12 moves. As far as I know you even have to do dash 0-frame throw to make this one work anyway.

    - /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/df.gif /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif + /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif +13 on sabaki (I think)

    - /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/d_.gif /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/f.gif /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif + /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif does not have super replay
    - BT /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif + /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif has super replay
    - /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/b.gif /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/f.gif /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif super replay on sabaki only

    - BT /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif + /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/g.gif on hit "down"

    - Again old info in notes section: /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif + /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/k.gif sabaki definately does not give +11 - +25. It's barely possible to get /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/b.gif /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/f.gif /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif to hit afterwards and I couldn't get /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/f.gif /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif to hit so +14 should be the best possible advantage (like it says in the "guard" column. Possibly could add a "+" in front of it to clear it up).

    - /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/b.gif /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/f.gif /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/p.gif + /forums/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/g.gif has "0" and "down" in wrong columns
     
    Combolammas, Mar 21, 2009
    #31
  12. Leonard_McCoy

    Leonard_McCoy Well-Known Member

    I think the advantage depends on the stance here. Open stance allows for a throw (with a dash-in), closed only for a punch startup.
     
    Leonard_McCoy, Mar 21, 2009
    #32
  13. Manjimaru

    Manjimaru Grumpy old man

    PSN:
    manjimaruFI
    XBL:
    freedfrmtheReal
    Both stances allow a dash-in for a 0-frame throw.
     
    Manjimaru, Mar 21, 2009
    #33
  14. Combolammas

    Combolammas Sheep

    You get guaranteed 0-frame throw from both and then there's the old stance specific sabaki -> throw without delays, but the advantage should be the same for both (and I would think it would be the old Evo +13 since there has been no reason to change it).
     
    Combolammas, Mar 22, 2009
    #34
  15. erdraug

    erdraug Well-Known Member Content Mgr Vanessa

    XBL:
    erdraug
    I just noticed that in Goh's tsukami section there are small [5] between each arrow [​IMG] So i thought i'd bump Combolammas list of additions by asking if that's done on purpose.

    PS: I also noticed that i when i meantioned "head stagger" in my last post akai understood i meant "head crumple" [​IMG]

    PS#2: And i also realized that i'm probably to blame for unclear differentiation between sabaki and inashi in the glossary [​IMG]
     
    erdraug, Oct 9, 2010
    #35
  16. Myke

    Myke Administrator Staff Member Content Manager Kage

    PSN:
    Myke623
    XBL:
    Myke623
    Corrections made to Goh's Ver.B and Ver.C command lists.

    This is how it is presented in the Black Book, and -- I'm no Goh player but I think -- it indicates that two consecutive directional inputs cannot be buffered too fast like you would a normal throw. The second input must occur during the first's animation, or something like that.
     
    Myke, Oct 12, 2010
    #36
  17. Leonard_McCoy

    Leonard_McCoy Well-Known Member

    As far as I recall, for those more elaborate Tsukami Grabs with two directions, you have to return the stick to neutral after the first input before registering a second direction to pull off the more damaging Tsukami Grab throws.
     
    Leonard_McCoy, Oct 12, 2010
    #37
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